Namma nadu Kannada, namma nudiyu Kannada

PDCS writes: Yesterday, Mysore’s Kannada intellectuals and activists were in the streets again, demanding the status of classical language to Kannada. Here is a comprehensive report in the Hindu on yesterday’s events. Their chosen target this time was the Central Institute of Indian Languages (CIIL), which as its director Dr. Uday Narayan Singh rightly pointed out does not have the statutory authority to accord the status.

Anyway, today’s controversy isn’t about where Prof. Jaware Gowda and his friends chose to protest. Dr. Singh, who was out of town, responded to the demands of the agitators in English, which has made Prof. Gowda mad. He wants Dr. Singh to be removed from his position for not knowing/learning Kannada.

Is it incumbent upon the Director of CIIL, a Central government entity or its employees to learn Kannada?

Moreover, while chasing the classical language status for Kannada, are we ignoring much needed work that needs to be done to bring Kannada language and culture into the twenty first century?

In that sense, do we need to emulate and support entities such as Kannadasaahithya.com, Kannada Ganaka Parishat and Sampada.net, all of which are doing interesting and valuable work?

Is it then time for us to begin a new discussion on the Kannada Kattuva Kelasa, as B M Shri famously said nearly a hundred years ago? Will that task involve seeking classical language status for Kannada?

Time for a new Churumuri campaign / brainstorming, I think.

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116 Responses to “Namma nadu Kannada, namma nudiyu Kannada”

  1. Bhamy V Shenoy Says:

    It is shocking to learn that our Kannada enthusiasts asking the CIIL’s Director to leave Mysore because he cannot speak Kannada. Such an arrogant act is so irrational there is no need to explain why. Did any one agree with arrogant behaviour of Shiva Sena when they asked all non Maharastrians to leave Mumbai few years ago? It was sad to see my friend G. T. N in this august company. I am sure he would disagree with such condemnable act.

    Most if not all of us have any admiration for most of our political leaders. Why should we then bother is they give classical status to Kannda langauage. Mahatma Gnadhi never got the Nobel Prize. Who lost? Actually it is the brand Nobel prize and not Mahatma Gandhi. Similarly if classical status is not conferred on Kannada, the loss is to the concept of classical langauge and not Kannada.

    Let us try to explore ways of popularizing Kannada by teaching it in the most delightful way or making it a need for outsiders to learn not through brute force but through hard work. Populist ways of locking CIIL doors or such protests will not take us any where.

  2. dr ramesh Says:

    sometimes pressure and force is the answer to many problems.
    karnataka and kannada has suffered from step motherly attitude from the centre. all disputes involving karnataka, even judiciary indulges in karnataka bashing. on the other hand private sector companies( IT BT) DENY employment to kannadigas.
    where are we to go, ITS ONLY NATURAL THAT WHEN THE VERY EXISTANCE OF PERSON, CULTURE , LANGUAGE IS THREATENED , FEELINGS WILL BE AROUSED. WE MUST SUPPORT KANNADA ACTIVISTS IN UPHOLDING OUR RIGHT.

  3. Ramanuja Says:

    I do not condone the happening at CIIL. But there is nothing wrong in protesting for the award of classical status to Kannada. Mr Shenoy’s arguments sound strange and confused. I think CIIL is in some way an unit of the Central Government and peaceful protests are thus justified ( Our elders protested in front of units which were organs of the then British Government. I can examples of these). For the sake of argument assume that the CIIL was located in Madurai, Tamil Nadu. Would its Director be some one who could not speak Tamil? The answer is very clear.

    We cannot remain sanguine about the Classical status issue as Mr Shenoy suggests. Mahama’s status was not diminished in practical terms when he was not awarded the prize despite his name was put forward I think at least 4 times. The issue of Kannada is totally different. There is good deal of truth in what Dr Ramesh Says.

  4. sisya Says:

    javare gowdaru matte avara snEhitaru maaDiruvudaralli tRuNadashTu tappilla.

    it is high time people like PDCS and BVS get off their high ‘morality’ horse and take an objective view of things.

    Kannadigas dont need lessons from anybody in being courteous, hospitable and tolerant. And if even our patience(Kannadigas) has been pushed to the limits, you can imagine what we must have gone through.

    Kannadakke usiru ettuvudE tappE. usiru ettaddre saaku you start branding them ‘fanatics’, ‘activists'(sic) and what not. they are neither activists nor fanatics, they are simply kannadigas. simple and pure. of course, unlike you people they are not out to please anybody, make friends and wear the so-called ‘secular’ badge with pride. that is for lesser mortals like you. nimmantha narasatta janagaLige.

    ishtella maataaDO neevgaLu, have you ever written or even bothered how the rest of india is working today. journalistgaLu. elli kongaru tamilge classical lang status heMge taMd koTTaru anta oMdu cover story barIri nODtini.

    kannadigas have had it playing the nice guy. why should all these highest ideals of mankind like ‘tolerance’, ‘cosmopolitanism'(sic), ‘secular’ etc be the kannadiga’s burden all the time? seriously, we need a change.

    dejagow mattu avara ella snEhitarigU jayavaagali!!

    p.s: and yes, avanu singh or whatever, karnatakadalli irabEku aMdare kannada gottirbEku. gottiralEbeku. Eniga?? heLi keLi CIIL directoru, kannada kalitare, is it below his dignity? avanaddE dEshada innoMd praaMtyada bhaashe kalitu maatanaaDidare avanappana mane gaMT Enaadaru hOgatta?

  5. sisya Says:

    “Is it incumbent upon the Director of CIIL, a Central government entity or its employees to learn Kannada?”

    why not? is there a law against it?? if so, then the law is an ass. central govt., state govt., pvt sector ella are irrelavent. karnatakadalli kelasa maaDOnu kannada kalidE innEn azerbaijani kalitana/kalibEka? anaadikaaladiMdaanU janagaLa valase naDitanE ide.. aadare hOda kaDe alliya jana, bhashe, samskRutige hoMdkoMD naDiyOdu manushyana kartavya. adanna hiMdella paalisuttanU iddarU. eega swaataMtra baMdidde taDa, last 15 varshadalli so called LPG baMdidde taDa, manushyana sahaja neeti, vartanEnE change maaDakke horTiddare.. naachikkEDu.

    hindi Enu swargdiMda iLidu baMta? baMdiddrU katte baala. adakke suLLu suLLu national lang annO prachaara koTTu, ellarannU mOsa maaDtiddare… adu rashtrabhashEnU alla(yaava constitutionalloo haagaMta bardilla), naaDabhaashenU alla.

    namma dEsha is supposedly built on ‘unity is diversity’. diversity kaapaaDkoLakke aagadE iddare, unity mane haaLaaga.

  6. jeevarathna Says:

    bhami avare,

    It was equally shocking to read your denigrating article on NAAC gradation system!

    I am sure you would not have been around when Dr. S.R. taught in Maharaja’s college. He may have been a great philosopher but we are not sure at this juncture whether he was a good teacher. Any way he was an import from Madras and literally begged for a job at UOM in those days !
    Dr. KLS never taught at Mysore , he was only a VC.

    Despite the current system and selection of VC & Registrar, it does not reflect on the caliber of teaching in the University. There will always a mixed bag in any generation. One summer does not make a swallow !

    But the moot question is how competent are you to comment on the present genre of Professor’s at UOM or the NAAC system? It is a an attempt to put in a system which will pave way for excellence in the system. It is only a beginning and what is the point in playing sour grapes. If you were to be made VC tomorrow will it make UOM a great Varsity? The great change if at all is that you have a mixed bag of students compared to the so-called golden days. Then only merit counted now you have reservation.

    It is easy to mumble from ivory towers more so if you have easy access to SOM and VT ! Stop your abracadabra and Hocus focus.

  7. Ramanuja Says:

    I do no know the motive behind Mr Shenoy’s pronouncements. If you want a job in any establishment in France you should speak French and Germans do want their professionals to speak German. What is wrong in saying that any one who wants a job in Karnataka ( in local or state or central government organsation) should speak, read and write in Kananda?

    I do see something lurking behind Mr Shenoy’s denegration of Mysore University today and its standards. It is to condemn it as no good and say some golden era for it existed perhaps when he studied and launch a movement ? To what end? Go back to 1940s and 50s when only middle class were able to send their sons to school. Young women were discouraged to study beyond high school. I am happy that Mysore University recruits students from all sections of the society in Mysore and elsewhere in Karnataka. Every generation gets good teachers and bad ones. There are good teachers even today at Mysore University.

    In Mysore today we need jobs for Mysoreans. We welcome any one who would like to settle here in Mysore or in Karnataka but only if heor she speak sthe local language and honour local customs. This is not jingoism; this is common sense. Every state from Kerala to Kashmir demands this. Why Mysore or Karnataka should be an exception?

  8. December Stud Says:

    Gawd, how artificial are we. Isn’t it the same De. Ja. Gow who said that Latha Rajashekhar deserves a Jnanpeeth ? Yeah right, hit me, I need one too.

    First and foremost, we need to stop worrying about comments made by people like De.Ja.Gow (I would love to include URA too, but at least he is damn intelligent !!!).

    trying to get rid of Dr. Singh just because he doesn;t know Kannada is the stupidest thing I have heard in a long time. There is a limit for fanaticism. Don’t we have Kannadiga central gevrnment employees who live in other states and don’t know that state language ? A better point for the De. Ja. Gow and the “kannaDa uLisuvavaru” is to ask Dr. Singh to try and learn Kannada , nothing wrong there. But, trying to get him sacked is downright foolish.

    There are inherent benefits in Kannada getting the classical language status. I am all for it. It’s not that we will suddenly see a surge in the Kannada speaking population or anything of that sort. Obviously we will start getting good central government funding, translations happen faster and a lot of those good things are embedded with the “classical” status and I do agree we truly deserve it.

    But guys, asking Dr. Singh to be removed is NOT the way we want to go. Sure, go and protest and do waht not peacefully, let’s put our point across, let’s make it clear. But, no point in losing the sight of what we really want.

    sisya, guruvE, so PDCS is on a high ‘morality’ horse, huh ? I don’t have to be PDCS’ lawyer here (I bet he can do a much better job defending himself), but some reality check here boss. As I said, nothing wrong in asking for classical status. But, askign Dr. Singh to quit is downright stupid. And, I definitely see that tinge of fanaticism in your post. “My father hit you, so you can hit me” is the stupidest argument in this world. Go figure !

  9. December Stud Says:

    OK, I guess I am not done yet……what intrigues me was…what were HSk, GTN, Akbar Ali and to a certain extent CPK thinking. Did they really know what was going on ? I am surprised to see these names here, to say the least.

    And coming to Mr. Shenoy’s comments on Gandhi not getting Nobel…puhleeeeze…this is no comparison. And, I am not sure such arguments are healthy either. “Look Gandhi didn’t win Nobel, nothing happened…so it’s OK if Kannada doesn’t get a classical language status” is not only foolosih, but borders the danger level. We cannot just sit and watch Mr. Shenoy. Practically speaking, getting the classical nod has tons of advantages and we ought to fight for it (Not the De.Ja.Gow way, of coruse)

    PDCS has a good point, we should definitely probably start brainstorming here…like the RK Narayan campaign. This is a much tougher job (but easier to get the mass involved….instigating is easy). How do we get our dear MP’s sitting in Delhi to realize that Kananda needs to get the classical status ? That solves ahlf the problem, I think.

  10. sisya Says:

    “Don’t we have Kannadiga central gevrnment employees who live in other states and don’t know that state language ? ”

    There may be. And I am not condoning that. Those people can feel free to throw them out. But then, with kannadigas it is an ‘exception’, while with others in karnataka, it is a ‘rule’.

    “And, I definitely see that tinge of fanaticism in your post.”
    you are free to see what you choose/want to see. but then, i’ve always believed that fanaticism begets fanaticism. it atleast ought to. and its probably time kannadigas became fanatics for a while. nothing wrong.

    btw, i see a lot of ignorance in yours(post).

  11. sisya Says:

    “Is it incumbent upon the Director of CIIL, a Central government entity or its employees to learn Kannada?”

    Somebody give me one valid reason, why a Central govt., employee in Karnataka or anywhere, should NOT be expected to know the language of the land?

    What extraordinary work or charity are they doing that ‘I’ have to learn ‘THEIR’ language to communicate with the government(remember they are govt servants) in a city/state where ‘MY’ language is the ‘language of the land’.

  12. sisya Says:

    “A better point for the De. Ja. Gow and the “kannaDa uLisuvavaru” is to ask Dr. Singh to try and learn Kannada , nothing wrong there.”

    And how much time do you propose to give such people? 1 year? 5 years? 10 years? 50 years?? Dr. Singh for one, has been in mysore for atleast more than five years(a cursory googling will tell u so). probably much more than that. he certainly deserves to get fired.

  13. H.R.Bapu Satyanarayana Says:

    Probably, it may be relevant to make parallel happening at the centre when the BJP stalwart and a person of stature Atal Behari Vajpayee charging the speaker. Speaker should not only be just but appear to be just. In this connection the focus may shift to speakers attitude in the case of Ofice of Profit and the Ganguly affair. The stand taken by the speaker in both the issues made the tounge wagging. Whatever may be the nuanced arguments that speaker used to justify his action it is clear Somnath Chatterjee hails from a party from West Bengal which is supposrting the govt from outside. The charge against BJP is that it adopted the cheap tactics in boycottting the parliament session. Unfortunately the whole political atmosphere is so vitiated that unless extreme form of protests are adopted the govt does not listen. BJP was only taking the cue for any polite form of protest has least effect on the Congress led UPA govt.

  14. dr ramesh Says:

    we are fighting for our rights—- if some call it fanaticism, so be it. if we suffer without protest we are called peace loving, cultured , what not. there is worst kind of linguistic racism in IT BT COMPANIES , CENTRAL PSU’S, RAILWAYS against kannadigas in bangalore. kannadigas are looked upon as third rate citizens. organizations like rakshana vedike,karunada sene are doing a great job in combating this injustice.

    in democracy protest is the most potent weapon.

    nimage kannada bedavaadre namage neevu beda.

  15. Ramanuja Says:

    OK, we are not asking Dr Singh to go but strongly suggesting him to learn Kannada fast! He should learn to talk and write in Kannada.

    Bhamy Shenoy, I do not know what his intentions are whatever they are his argiments sound ‘barmy’ to me. We in Karanataka and Mysore cannot keep quiet as we are over run by people from other states, create their ghettos in Bangalore and now Mysore and make no real attempt to learn the language.

    The monent the DMK won the elections in early 1960s, the people from Andhra Pradesh who held the Madras ( Chennai)in a vice-like grip until then either learnt Tamil or left Madras. You cannot find a non-tamil speaking head of any organisation in that state.

    There will be much lost in Kannada loses out. Leave Barmy Shenoy out and we should fight until Kannada and kannadigas are not treated as foreigners in their own state.

  16. dr ramesh Says:

    good one sir, till now mysore has not infected with anti-kannada parasites. namma bengalooru– its a daily fight to keep our language,culture afloat.
    atleast intellectuals, kannada activists should protect mysore from slipping away from kannadigas.
    anti- kannadigas are like cockroaches, if u see one , its sure that there are many hiding

  17. greymatter Says:

    the point about not giving an individual a job in a governmental organization in karnataka, just because he/she doesnot know kannada is not at all valid. a lot of us kannadigas work in the central government offices without knowing a wee bit of hindi…so if the point mentioned in a few comments above should hold good, we should not be given jobs in India, for not knowing our national language.

    one of the few qualities about a Kannadiga (person from Karnataka) that i was proud of was that fact that we don’t do much of moral policing. looks like things are changing!!!

  18. greymatter Says:

    peaceful protests are always welcome, but protesting on a main road, blackening any sign board which has writings in english or for that matter even hindi, portrays a kannadiga in bad light!!! something we should discourage.

  19. Prashanth Says:

    Kannada, by its essense is a classical divine language, and if Central Govt doesnot give the status to it, thenn everyone knows Why. Its because of the Peer pressure from TN, the concept of Classical Language started and given first to Tamil. Probably, an year after that, to save their A**, the Central Govt has given the status to Sanskrit.

    Entire World knows that Sanskrit is THE OLDEST LANGUAGE, and we call it “DEVANAGARI LIPI” meaning Language of Gods, and our central Govt has kept it as second in the List.

    Knowing that, Central Govt is Insane and the Selection process is irrational for this, i hardly have any trust on the entire process for this. I f the Central Govt tells Some language identified as the first Classical Language, its only them who are telling. Yes, of course, having this status is good for the state that there will be enough funds routed to State from Center for the Language Developement, but question is what percentage of that amount will really be used for the Language developement?? And , is the Language developement only by Govt(!?), and are we not the People responsible for it.

    Irrespective of this status, we need to Unite and develop/enhance/popularize our Kasturi Kannada….Thats the best that we can do to our Maathru Bhashe alva?

    Jai Karnataka maathe

  20. December Stud Says:

    sisya, guruve, your posts certainly reek with “offense is the best defense” thingy. Taking extreme steps (in any matter) is not only foolish, but outright illogical. If you read my posts carefully, you will realize that I am all for Kannada getting the classical status, it’s just the foolish manner in which people protest, which bothers me.

    Well, what do I know, afterall I am ignorant. But wait a second, isn’t ignorance a bliss ???

  21. E.R. Ramachandran Says:

    Tamil Nadu and A.P. have strong regional Parties which take advantage of their position and get what their State needs by stongarm methods. Naidu and NTR understood this very well and so did J & K in Tamil Nadu! Karunanidhi sneezed and lo!,center got cold feet and stopped the disinvestment in Neyvelli Lignite corp. Simlarly, he is trying to force 27% reservation issue.

    Against that what do we have in Karnataka? Siddu runs to hold the apron of Soniaji, and HDK takes blessings from Vajpayee!Unless the State is strong, Centre, no matter which Party they belong to ,wouldn’t give a damn.We will be shortchanged on Cauvery issue, people will dare to open Belgaum issue, we won’t get double line between Bangalore- Mysore and so on and so forth.

    In the absence of leaders who can build a strong Regional Party, we will have to wait for ‘Alms’ thrown at us by the Centre. At leaset the people power is working and we should go for what we want, all by ourselves. ‘It’s only the crying baby that gets milk’. There is nothing wrong in trying to get what is just and correct.

    We should , simultaneously popularise Kannada by newer methods so that more people learn the same. In that direction, our efforts are way below the mark.

  22. December Stud Says:

    Prashanth,

    Just to clear a few points….for one we’ll never know the truth. History is bogus. That said, I am not sure you can declare in BOLD that sanskrit is the oldest language.

    I have read quite a bit about Tamil being the oldest Indian language. And, I was recently going through a lengthy presentation which talks about Kannada’s origin from Tamil a few centuries before christ.

    Just an FYI….Not to fight over it ;)

  23. December Stud Says:

    Mr. Ramachandran,

    I am not sure absence of leaders is the reason for lack of a regional party. I have discussed this with several people. Maybe, it’s just not in us Kannadigas to accept a regional party. I may be wrong, but just my take. See whta happened to Vijay sankeshwar, with all that money and stuff….

    My 2 cents……oops, I guess I should say my 2 paise, else people may brand me as ignorant…whatever.

  24. Arun Padaki Says:

    Agree with Mr.Ramachandran.
    Now it’s time for us to ponder whether fanaticism is a better option vis-à-vis the pride of being Kannadigas. Agree, at times we need to be fanatics to tackle fanaticism detrimental to Kannada. But then, looking at the bigger picture, how strong is the political leadership in Karnataka to uphold the interest of Kannadigas? How many politicians do we have who show that development of Kannada is significant apart from few gimmicks that some resort to? Is there a single election manifesto that says that Kannada or Kannadathhva will be upheld? Sometime back when non-Kannada movies were released after several weeks, one of the prominent Kannada activists said – “kannadavannu ulisokke, chalanachithrada maadhyamave pramukha”. What a disgrace? Do we really need to take this route knowing what movies are made these days? At the same time, not to take the credit away from good Kannada movies, some have made noises that are very good for Kannada movies and Kannada too. Let us not forget that we too have candidates who top UPSC exams and we too can be subject to target by real fanatics in other states. Actions of Vedike and Sene are only momentary and not deep, neither sustained. But they have arrived. As a Kannadiga it pains to see that we have to struggle to get our way through in our own State. Let us thank our politicians who are more interested in settling personal scores, spending more time to get funds for their parties, jumping parties, scouting reasons for blaming the opponents and finding excuses for their follies. Its 50 years, and we do not have a regional party of our own. It’s time for us to move above all these protests (very much required at times), re-painting bus route numbers in Kannada to a higher level of participation. Newer methods as said above.

  25. rk Says:

    TO ERR IS HUMAN, TO BE HUMOUROUSLY CORRECT IS ERR

  26. greymatter Says:

    looks like bangalore is becoming the next bombay, with its own shiv-sena like version!!!! can’t wait for that day.

  27. Ramanuja Says:

    I agree we need a strong rregional party. Besides that we need leaders of industry who respect Kannanda and recruit Kannadigas. We have amidst us what I would call ‘quislings’ who pretending to be Kannadigas indeed say and act as ‘Barmy Shenoy’ does. With so called friends like him who need enemies of Kannada?

    I also agree that we have had weak state leadership congress or otherwise for ages. Starting from kengal to the current infantile leader, all they did and have been doing is looking after themselves and lining their packets. The difference between these political leaders and those in Tamil Nadu, is that as well as lining their own packets, the Tamil Nadu leaders also do things for their state.

    Dr Singh would not have lasted a single day in Chennai. Non-violence strong direct actions are the only way to convince the villains at the centre , state and local levels ( please do not forget we have villains amidst us, here in Mysore , I have named one who through his pronouncements is working against Kannadigas’ interests) that it is time that Kananda and Kannadigas had their well deserved recognition.

  28. greymatter Says:

    i guess the world “liberal kannadiga” doesn’t exist in Mr ramanuja’s word bank…if you are a kannadiga only if you are a “fanatic” kind. and it seems like anybody who is liberal is also pretending to be a kannadiga!!! God save Karnataka.

  29. Prashanth Says:

    December Stud
    If History is Bogus, then Tamil being being told as the oldest language is evident from History, is also Bogus.

    If your findings from that lengthy presentation tells that Kannada has origin from Tamil, then why they look and feel different? Does that presentation aslso tells that, Telugu is also derived out of Tamil, since Kannada and Telugu looks almost similar!? Does that presentation also tells anything on, why some words in Kannada have Phonetic and similar meanings of Sanskrit, but not tamil?? Is that also tells that, sanskrit is also derived out of Tamil!?

    And my statement of telling Sanskrit being the oldest Language is not based on somepresentations, but i have studied Sanskrit for 5 long years.

    Just FYI, not to fight over it ;-)

  30. sisya Says:

    everyone agrees we need a regional party. now who is more likely to give us one – the so called ‘fanatics'(KRV etc) or the popcorn crowd led by studs like december stud. fieldge iLiyakke aagalla, kayyi mayyi maN maaDkoLakke ishta illa, iLidu oddaaDtirOrge kanishta encourage maaDbEku annO gyaananU illa… elli inthaadakkella iLad biTre tamma so called ‘educated’ and ‘secular’ credentialsge dhakke baMdbiDattOO… compound mele koothu kaal allaDasta tamashi nODakke kELi, ettida kayyi.

    firs of all stop branding KRV and such others ‘fanatics’. THEY ARE NOT!

    “If you read my posts carefully, you will realize that I am all for Kannada getting the classical status, it’s just the foolish manner in which people protest, which bothers me.”

    maneli koothu japa maaDi, classical status certificate print maaDi manEge kaLastare. huh.

    Tell me what is foolish about the way in which they protested? CIIL(a central govt office) muMde protest maaDiddu tappa? illa 6 varshadiMda mysorealli gooTa hoDkoMD kootu, innU kannada barade irO bOLi maganna kith haaki aMdiddu tappa?

    and as for your comment that tamil is older than kannada(or was it mankind?? LOL :)), less said the better. you dont have to try so hard to prove your ignorance.

  31. Prasad Says:

    Looks like this post is generating a lot of comments.
    My own opinion is that the focus should be on making Kannada stronger in our own state, not worrying about if XYZ knows or does not know Kannada. As Arun pointed out, there are Kannadigas too that are serving in Central Govt organizations in other states so extreme fanaticism can be counter-productive.
    To get Kannada a classical language status, there needs to be a movement which gathers some momentum. While protests are just one part of it, there also has to be an education of our own MPs, MLAs & concerned authorities of the Central Govt about this.

    Another point we have to see is when we talk about making Kannada stronger, we should not blindly compare it to Tamil or Telugu or Bengali or Punjabi. We need a reality check by also considering the economic angle. There are approx. 35 million Kannada speakers (as per Wikipedia) as opposed to 70 million Telugu & 68 million Tamil speakers which makes it double. Also all the above mentioned have a diaspora – Telugus in the US & Tamils in other countries that support a lot of language related activities – not just academic but films, TV channels & cultural programs. The larger number of speakers also gives them more space & visibility in the media & political clout in terms of MPs etc. Also the literacy
    So is the case with Bengali & Punjabi which have many more speakers all over the world. In their case their diaspora and the support they get from other South Asian countries gives them more TV channels, movies etc.

    Among comparable number of speakers Malayalam (37 million) & Oriya (32 million) have similar numbers as Kannada speakers. In the case of Malayalam I feel the large number of people speaking the language spread out in the Middle East & other countries & having pockets in many of the big cities in India helps them a lot even though the numbers are smallers. One main feature is that there are strong Malayalee associations wherever they are settled who do a lot of lobbying for cultural & related activities. They also remit lots of funds towards this aspect.

    In the case of Kannada there is no comparable diaspora not does it have political clout. So the main focus should be to make it strong in our own state without worrying about others or feeling threatened or even resorting to extreme steps.
    For this we need to make the political class more aware. Then we as people also have to support Kannada films & media in a strong way not using shortcuts or strong arm measures or government patronage (like making it tax free) but encouraging it so readership or viewership is increased.
    Thirdly we need more support at the government level for academic, stronger literacy drives & activities needed to make the language more technology friendly. My own feeling is that all this will happen sooner or later. Once there are enough numbers everything else will automatically follow.

  32. Prashanth Says:

    time idhre ee link check maadi

    :-)

    http://www.totalkannada.com/Kannada%20is%20as%20old%20as%20Tamil.asp

  33. Prasad Says:

    Olle link and good argument. Ondu campaign shuru maadi ee vishaya ella MPs & ministers ge kalisidare chennagirutte.

  34. Ramanuja Says:

    Nothing happens automatically and if there were no stirs India would not have achieved independence. I do agree that we should spread Kannanda through initiatives etc.. But this may a very long time perhaps even decades. Diasporas at best can fund movement and put pressure on the central government etc.. History is littered with instances when the goverment had to listen to people’s desires marshalled in a proper way. As well as considering other approaches, the foremeost weapon in the armoury is well-organised peaceful demonstrations. These should take place taluk-wide, district-wide and state-wide then only the goverments, centre and state will notice. Public figues with passion for Kannada should start building volunteer groups at all levels.

  35. ದೀರೇಂದ್ರ ಗೋಪಾಲ್ Says:

    lee thammandira..yistu dhina sumne Odhuthayidhe..yeega yerdu maathadokke avkaasha sikkithu

    Maneli pashtu nimma AikLu thava Kannada maathadree…maneye modhala paatashaaLe annodhannu druda padisri..
    Sumne yaake haaytheera…bari mathin putnanji thara…

  36. December Stud Says:

    Prashanth,

    Sure, you have studied Sanskrit for 5 years. Maybe I ahve , maybe I have not. I am not sure how relevant that is here. I have to tell you that there is a very popular misconception among a lot of Indians that Sanskrit is older than Tamil. Well, I shouldn’t call it a mis-conception. Let me restate, there re two schools of historians one who claim Sanskrit is older and the other who claim Tamil is older.

    Since you actually calim that Sanskrit is the oldest language I bet you have actually read linguistics, at least a little (usually very few ignorant fools like me post ehre, most people know what they say). So, I bet you do realize that most scholars agree that Tamil being the oldest Indian language is the more likely ‘truth’. Then again, I am sure you already knew this.

    Just think about it this way…..how the Aryan invasion theory became famous, and then infamous. Now, do you really believe that the Aryans came from outside, or were they indigenous ?

    The same kinda flux holds good for the Sanskrit vs Tamil argument.

    sisya,

    Isn’t it so obvious that you are bitter ? Come on man, now you want to say Kananda is older than Tamil ? Yeah right. Being vocal and being passionate about something which we believe in is one thing, trying to come up with a cock-and-bull story just to try and prove a point is completely different. get a hold on it dude !!!

    Oh and for the more intelligent folks than I am (that is you sisya ;) ), I recentlay sat with Dr. N.S.Lakshminarayana Bhatta for over 15 hours to discuss the topic on Kannada and it’s origin. And, that’s when he quoted and showed me the research on the origin of Kannada and how it may have sprouted out of Tamil a few centuries before christ. Plus, how Tamil just did not grow in terms of languagae and how Kananda grabbed a lot of words from different languages, bulk of it from Sanskrit (and that should answer your question Prashanth) etc…etc…

    So, sisya, I am just a messenger here. I guess it’s the likes of Dr. NSL Bhatta who are really ignorant, I just post blah. I sure will tell him that though (and I wonder what his reaction will be !).

  37. sisya Says:

    stud,

    now since you had the patience to sit through a 15 hour session with Dr. NSL, i exhort you to please read what Dr. BGL Swamy has to say about this matter in his book, “Tamilu talegaLa naDuve”. Please read it if you havent(doesnt look like you have). Dr. BGL Swamy’s credentials by the way, are as impeccable as Dr. NSL, if not better.

    TTN is not the only book Dr. BGLS has written about this issue. Also try to get a hold of his “Tewaram trio: an analysis and a reappraisal”, “The four samayacharyas of tamil country in epigraphy”(this last one is a journal)…

    As for sanskrit vs tamil vis a vis the AIT, whats your point? AIT is prima fa cie a cock and bull story. And the people holding on to it most aggressively are the kongas. But for AIT, Periyar and co’s demented ‘Dravidian’ theories go right out of the window. hmmm…there’s a lot to say… if u’re on orkut.. i can give u a thread where ppul are discussing this and allied issues threadbare…

    to sum up, in BGLS’ own words, much of tamil ‘history’ is “neTTu neerereda kalpaneya kaaDu”. please read it.

  38. sisya Says:

    and kannada ‘sprouting’ from tamil sounds like a big load of bull. even tamil historians dont make that claim.

    the theory is that both tamil and kannada originated from proto-dravidian. and proto-dravidian was NOT TAMIL. also kannada branched off much earlier from proto dravidian as compared to tamil. so there is no question of kannada ‘sprouting’ from tamil.

  39. ದೀರೇಂದ್ರ ಗೋಪಾಲ್ Says:

    Sisya..Bombattu..naanu mathadhnella neene aadthidhya
    B.T.W mundvarilee

  40. December Stud Says:

    Ahh…at least now we are on the same plank, evn if it is the opposite ends. I don’t mind arguing with rationale.

    I have heard tons about TTN, never actually read it. I guess now that you say that it’s that good, should go buy it and read.

    My point is that you can never have black and white in history (not the American history, that’s full of it of course :) ). Thus, statements like “AIT is a cock and bull story” or even “Tamil history is ‘neTTu nIrereda kalpaneya kADu'” make me squirm. Since we will never ever get proper evidence, it is very hard to completely dismiss the theory. Tilting towads one is fine, but completely dismissing it is a lot different. IMO, it’s just a feel good factor.

    Now, if you really want to read some cock-and-bull stories and good humor, go to dravidistan.org.

    Ummm….Well, I’ve been posting so much BS in churumuri over the past several months and I have been getting quite a handful of resposes….Not bad for an ignorant fool, huh ? ;)

  41. sisya Says:

    “My point is that you can never have black and white in history”
    And yet you dont have any qualms taking the kongas’ theories at face value.

    “Thus, statements like “AIT is a cock and bull story” ”
    I said ‘PRIMA-FACIE’.

    “or even “Tamil history is ‘neTTu nIrereda kalpaneya kADu’” make me squirm.”
    it wont. once you finish reading TTN. btw, those words arent BGLS’ opening lines. they’re his closing thoughts. so you can read it without prejudice.

    “Now, if you really want to read some cock-and-bull stories and good humor, go to dravidistan.org.”
    also try dalitstan.com(or org or whatever), tamilnation.org, many tamil related pages on wikipedia(which cite from the other two sites if need be!).

  42. sisya Says:

    forget historians and experts. just examine these theories yourself.

    AIT for e.g. if it is true that Aryans did infact, invade us or even peacefully migrate into India(and drive the native ‘dravidians’ southwards and finally into the south), that means these so called aryans who now inhabit north india are a different race(the european aryans certainly are!).

    now do you think, the guy in bihar is ‘racially’ different from the one in karnataka or andhra or TN or kerala?

    the only purpose this Aryan-Dravidian distinction serves is that of the so called ‘real Aryans’ who could use it to prove their ‘superiority’ as a race, and the kongas(led by periyar, annadorai, MK etc) who have a vested interest in proving they’re different from the Aryans.

    Periyar harbored a visceral hate for brahmins including tamil speaking brahmins and no wonder he found this Aryan-Dravidian distinction irresistible. How else would he convince a fellow tamil that tamilian brahmins werent tamilians at all?!

    half way across the globe a certain Mr. Hitler also found it irresistible.

    Does all this tell u anything about the theory itself? It does. To me.

  43. Prasad Says:

    I think the main thing is that a lot of brainstorming (if you can call it that) is happening so hopefully some good will come of it. It might even start off a campaign.
    DG nimmanu illi nodi baha santhoshavaayitu.

    Interestingly one account in Wikipedia says that both Kannada & Tamil branched out from Proto-Dravidian after Tulu. Does it mean we have two classical languages in our state?

  44. Ramanuja Says:

    Come on ,do not branch off into another argument on Kannada vs Tamil and waste energy on discussing esoteric aspects of languages. These can wait after we have achieved what we want- recognition of Kannada as a classical language, Kannadigas respected in Karnataka and in Karnataka, Kannadigas come first, second ,and always.

  45. H.R.Bapu Satyanarayana Says:

    Quite entertaining even if the truth is a chimera like chasing a crooked shadow. May be it is like going to a shrink and get cleaned up and come out chastened. Blog has its advantages and saves lot of money and tickles our gray cells and help to keep Alzemer or Parkinson’s diseases away

  46. dr ramesh Says:

    need of the hour is streetsmart, dedicated people like narayanagowda( KRV), CHAMRAJNAGAR MP SHIVANNA who can fight for kannada cause in a proactive way.

    horata madbeku andre DHYEYA
    DHAIRYA yeradu irbeku.

    militant form of kannada chauvinism is the need of the hour.
    arm chair critics sumne matadtare, yenu kelsa maadalla.

  47. Prashanth Says:

    December Stud
    Some links for U

    http://www.engr.mun.ca/~adluri/telugu/language/script/script1a.html

    http://www.ece.neu.edu/~hkashyap/papers/IEEE-ISCAS-2003-1.pdf

    And

    >>So, I bet you do realize that most scholars agree that Tamil being the >>oldest Indian language is the more likely ‘truth’.

    If most scholars belive that, they are all biased….

    I dont know, whehter u know this or wud believe this but

    There is something called ‘Mahestwara Suthra’ which is the origin of words. If u think u have time, try knowing abt that.

    enjoy maadi ;-)

  48. December Stud Says:

    LOL @ Prashanth,

    I guess you meant ‘Maheshwara Suthra’ ??? I guess I know….

    And for the doctor who says “militant form of kannada chauvinism is the need of the hour.”…Sir, militant form of anything is WRONG !!! I bet you read today’s newspapers, didn’t you ???

  49. Prashanth Says:

    ROFL @ December Stud!

    Interesting to know tht u guessed u know it!

    Need of the Hour is awareness and promotion of our Kasturi Kannada, not LOL or ROFL whtever, i feel!

    :-)

  50. dr ramesh Says:

    sir, apaartha madkondiddera. militant form andre more proactive. banks,shopping malls – kannada maathdidre humiliate maadthare. those people should be slapped on their faces. when a poor farmer goes to an IAS officer to complain , officer talks in english, what will that farmer do, please tell me.
    adakke antha janarige yetu kodbeku.
    proactive chauvinism is needed.

  51. Ramanuja Says:

    Could we stop sniping and dragging the arguments into some other topic. This has been our problem always, dissipating energies on matters unproductive.

    Those of us who passinately believe in ensuring Kannada and Kannadigas get the right recognition which is long over due, sink our petty differences and agree to join hands and work proactively. We need more protests and more dharnas, all peaceful. The bottomline for us, the Kannadigas ,is that those who take up jobs whatever level should speak fluent Kannada and write in fluent Kannada. No excuse for an IAS officer talking in English to a farmer. This officer should not be posted in a state whose language he/she cannot speak or write. This does not happen in other states. Until our minister are made to realise this, that is what protests and dharnas would do, nothing much will be achieved in this regard.

  52. V.R.Anil Kumar Says:

    To say that Kannada came forth from Tamil is absurd.There was a Moola Dravida Bhashe out of which came Tamil, Telugu, Kannada and Malayalam and Tulu etc. To say that Tamil is older than Sanskrit is also far fetched. The earliest Tamil works found are from 2nd century AD and the Tamil Script is derived from Ashokan Brahmi script. The latest period of Vedas as conceded by even foreign scholars is 1500 BC though Indian scholars believe that they are much much older(actually Anadi). Panini wrote Asthadhyayi in Sanskrit and his life was from 520 to 460 BC.The earliest reference to Kannada has been found in Ashoka’s Brahmagiri Edict of 230 BC. I do not think Kannada needs to play second fiddle to any other language.

  53. E.R. Ramachandran Says:

    It again comes back to how strong we are! A Dep. Rly Minister openly says Nix to Karnataka C.M. on Doubling B-M Rly Project. C.M. cries that Centre is giving Flood relief fund only to Mah and A.P.If we mattered, if we had the numbers to ‘rock’ the Govt., P.M. would have sent half a dozen Ministers with the letter according the classical status, the day Karnataka Govt. asked for it! Even if Centre now gives Kannada a classical status – Believe me – it is alms thrown at us. NTR showed what Telugu ‘Pourusham’ could do to Indira / Rajiv when Rajiv Gandhi ‘insulted ‘ A.P. Congress leader Anjaiah at Hyderabad Airport. Will we ever do that? Can we do that for once and show how strong Kannadigas are? Alas! we don’t have any charismatic person like Raj kumar to lead. Even ,he was unwilling..Let’s remember..the response for strength, force is admiration and sometimes fear. The large Number of M.P.s the Regional parties send to Lok Sabha and the necessity of sheer survival determines the behaviour of Centre towards the State Govt.That is what A.P. , T.N have capitalised and continue to do so…

  54. Ramanuja Says:

    We Kannadigas are too generous and too broadminded and have allowed ghettos of people speaking other languages to be formed in Banglore for example, and let non-Kannadigas to get jobs in Central organisations, with the exclusion of Kannadigas. When BEL and HMT were formed, its senior managers were non-Kannadigas and parachial factors reigned supreme. I had seen batches and batches of engineers and scientists were recruited from other states. When I protested at one time asking why there were no Kannadigas in them , I was bluntly told that the Kannadiga engineers who applied had no skills set they were looking fo,r which was plainly absurd. These senior managers would start in English in meetings ,and quickly switch to their mother tongues (Kannada was not one of them) as they knew that except myself and perhaps one other, all others could speak these languages ( they recruited them and they should know). I get information that Mysore has not escaped from this disease.

    The first thing we Kannadigas can do in tangible terms is to agitate and stop the above taking place, force peacefully through agitations and dharnas, recruitment of Kannadagas at all levels in Central organisations. Kannadigas have academic achievements, merits and skills and for decades they have been suffering from lack of oppotunities as the recruitment practices are skewed in favour of just about any one who is not a Kannadiga.

    We cannot depend on our infantile CM , his ministers, MLAs and our MPs. The agitations should start in every taluk and district and move to the state level. Without proactive actions Kannadigas and Kannada will not get the deserved justice.

  55. Prakash Says:

    Lets start from Infosys. Let them recruit Kannadigas in Transport department and Canteen services .Where I heard Tamils and Telugus dominate.
    Can we ?? .I am asking Infosys because maojority of founders aere kannadigas and One company which has benefitted immensely from state .

  56. Vijay Says:

    Sir, I have worked for Infy before and it is the most anti-kannadiga orgainsation I have ever seen. You can see that even in the boards leading to Infosys in Mysore. All jobs are occupied by others. Only a miniscule percentage of the people getting in as freshers are kannada speaking. Mysore campusnalliruva caterers, grocery store owner, barbers, konege fruit juice maaruvanu kooda malayaLi.

    Infosysna karnaatakadinda oDisida dina ee raajyakke mukti sikkeetu. yaake kannadigarna togolalla anta kelidre “naavu global company, global respectu, best talentu” antella eneno baay badkotaare.

    I can tell u that not more than 10% of the employees of infosys IN KARNATAKA are kannada speaking. you can conviniently forget all other locations

  57. abhaya Says:

    really glad to see somany talking about kannada. after seeing the same people in mysore talking, protesting about things from 70s it feels good to know new force is voicing its opinion. can we look at fundamental problems of kannada. its very easy for us to say we should protest, be active, sack people for not knowing kannada. who will sack the people who will not produce attrative books, alphabet charts – in kannada? i have spoken to a lot of publishers – navakarnataka, sapna etc, toy shop owners to get me attractive things in kannada; they say there is no demand. producers will produce what is in demand. what do we do? i have bought more books in english just because they are attractive, colourful and of good quality. i think our concern is the same: to keep kannada alive. i have a simple project for that: i talk to my daughter in kannada, teach her to write and read kannada – that’s how i make sure kannada has future. i speak to all the shop keepers in kannada in bangalore. i dont care if they understand or not; if they do not give me first priority or not. for me these small gestures are more important than going on protest march on streets.

  58. dr ramesh Says:

    feed a dog once, it is loyal to you for life.
    when an animal which lives for 8-10 yrs can have loyalty

    kannadigaraada NRN ge yen roga.
    anthavarige namma dhikkara.

    shame NRN.

  59. Ramanuja Says:

    The so called IT industrialists are here just to make money for themselves.
    The poor university student in Mysore who is a Kannadiga thinks foolishly that he will get an opportunity to work at these IT code factory. The government also thinks foolishly that these IT industrialists will put Mysore on the world map and pander to the wishes of these industrialists. Both are deluding themselves. The IT industrialist sets up IT sweat shop for the IT coolies and pockets the profits and laughs all the way to the bank. Not only these industries not give jobs to Kannadigas, they pollute beautiful Mysore and push it into the road to ruin, the way Bnagalore has gone.

    When do Myosre Kannadigas wake up?

  60. Ramanuja Says:

    Since 1950s, when I was in middle and high schools, well-meaning Kannadigas have been urging us to speak in Kannada and write in Kannada, and feel as Kannadiga. Even with the best efforts,during these 50 years, this approach has not produced required results. In reality, things have become worse. In 1955 in Bangalore and Mysore, Kannada was spoken by a majority and Kannadigas including myself got jobs in industries. Can any one say that this situation is any better now? Are Kannadigas getting priorities in matters of jobs and education? Is Kannada being spoken by a majority now? The linguistic states, starting from the birth of Andhra Pradesh were created to foster the specific language of the state concerned and encourage the culture associated with the language. It was reasonable to expect from those who migrate into a state to be able to transact business in the language of the state. Is this happening now? It was also reasonable to assume that the citizens of a state, speaking the language of the state could expect priority or at the minimum expect a level-playing field on matters of jobs. Is this the reality now?

    The time for softly softly approach is over and the time for some proactive actions including people agitations and dharanas has arrived. Let us all join hands to get what is long overdue.

  61. dr ramesh Says:

    during his AUG 15 speech C M has insisted on jobs for locals in IT services. it is a good move, at least kumaaraswamy has the guts to say this public.
    responsible kannadigas should exert more pressure on IT COMPANIES. IF THEY DONT RELENT—- FORCE IS THE ONLY ANSWER.

  62. Vijay Says:

    Im afraid Kumaraswamy isnt going to do much. He said the other day “IT BT galalli kannadigarige udyoga koDi andre anti-IT anta hanepaTTi kaTtaare. adakke doDDovra vishayakke hOgade irode oLLedu”..Can we expect anything more pusillanimous from a person who is supposed to be our leader? I feel let down by. kumaraNNa, uttarakumarana pourusha beDavaNNa!

    NRN, please shift out of Karnataka. We dont want Bangalore/karnataka to be No 1.

  63. dr ramesh Says:

    there is no difference between infosys,biocon and EAST INDIA COMPANY which came to india as trading company and ruled us for many decades.
    IT COMPANIES LOOTING LANDS FROM FARMERS OF KARNATAKA,
    NOT GIVING JOBS TO LOCALITES, ANTI-KANNADA , TREATS KANNADIGAS AS THIRD RATE CITIZENS.

    YAARIGE BANTHU SWAATANTRA.

  64. abhaya Says:

    if narayana murthy and infosys are responsible to save kannada language, culture etc, what is teh responsibility of azim premji and wipro, IBM, Oracle, Mphasis, all the BPOs adn medical transcribing companies in karnataka? what is the role of kannada sahitya parishat, kannada pradhikara? what should all NRI software engineers of kuvempunagar and sarswathipuram do? what happens to each one of us who claim to be kannidigas?
    i distinctly remember 1980s and gokak movement in mysore. a bunch of kannada prof of university of mysore, writers, critics asserted their belief in kannada as medium of instruction and put their children in manasagangotri school. initailly english and kannada medium were together. when the school became strictly kannada medium school due to the efforts of these people, few of us remained in school as students. all of us were children of kannada prof. the science prof took their children to st.josephs. i am proud to be in the group of belivers. our parents did not stop us from learning other languages; they created an opportunity for us to learn a lot more than other kids. they were not too proud to send their children to a school where university peon’s child sat next to them, learnt with them, played with them. They were active participants in the growth of the institution.
    Tell me, how many of us go back home and talk to our children in kannada? How many of us enough in kannada as medium of instruction to send our children to kannada medium schools? How many of our children use the terms chikkappa, chikkamma, amma, appa, ate, mava etc instead of uncle, aunty, mummy, daddy? We want our children to compete with their ‘cousins’ in America. So we introduce them to the language, sandwiches, macdonalds, pizza spoons, knives, forks etc. hence, language, ragi mudde, rotti, payasa, soppina saru gets sidelined. Are we not sitting in glass houses when we blame other people and point fingers at them? Cant we create a present and future for kannada without all this mud slinging?

  65. December Stud Says:

    Abhaya,

    I have been reading your comments on different topics and have been a big fan ;)

    You have put the points very well, almost hit the bull’s eye !!!

    I was shocked, I am not joking, literally ‘shocked’ to find out that a relative of mine speaks with her 7 year old son only in English. She grew up in a very small town, studied in Kannada medium and did her PhD. I just assumed that it was normal that all the Kannadigas speak to their kids in kannada at home. It was indeed an eye opener.

    As far as Navakarnataka, I remember them having excellent books in Kannada when I was a kid. Infact, I still have all those books…extremely colorful, text in big fonts and I loved to read those books.

    One of your points which I take exception to is the Kannada medium thingy. I definitely understand your point and the reasoning behind it. But, just going to a Kannada medium school does NOT solve the issue. Take the example of my relative who talks to her son in English (and English ONLY). I know tons of people like me who studied in English medium throughout, and have the love for the language, not to mention, an excellent grip on the language too…..

  66. dr ramesh Says:

    kannadigara dourbhagyave idu,
    big salaried IT JOBS GOES TO NON-KANNADIGAS, THEY ACQUIRE TREMENDOUS BUYING CAPACITY, BUY PLOTS—– KANNADIGAS BEING DENIED EMPLOYMENT CANNOT BUY LAND IN THIS SCENARIO.
    bengalurinalli ivatthu madhyama vargada kannadiga ondu site kharidi madokke sadhya aagta illa. these things do make a lot of difference.
    we are definitely not interested in mud slinging, if we are condemned, ridiculed — we have to give it back, much harder.

  67. Naanu Says:

    An article related to this discussion http://thatskannada.oneindia.in/column/ravibelagere/140806infosys.html
    and my take on it at https://naanunaane.wordpress.com

  68. abhaya Says:

    december stud, thanks for the compliment.
    i am not saying that sending our kids to kannada medium school will solve the problem. ironically, in mysore atleast, one kid of every kannada prof has done postgraduation in english literature, including me. but the present day kannada prof’s children, i am familiar with those studying in Christ College, bangalroe, take sanskrit as second language! what does that mean – kannada is not viable even as second langauge?
    i remember all those students who would go to sleep if went on talking in english for 10min in mahajana’s college. my kannada improved after started teaching english. most of our students dont know they dont have to take englsih as a compulsory lagnauge. they can take any two langauges. they spend half of their lfie reading guides which dont teach them neither the language, nor the subject just to get 35.
    if i can get those books i would love to buy them. maybe next time i will visit navakarnataka and ask them dig their storage.

  69. Matyady Gopal Says:

    The Tamil-is-the-mother-of-all-languages theory, propagated by die-hard Tamil chauvinists, is sheer bullshit. Dr. BGL Swamy, well-known botanist and Kannada litterateur, has exposed, in his book “TamiLu TalegaLa NaDuve”, the modus operandi of the Tamil scholars to keep this theory alive. They used to destroy all such books which doubt or question the antiquity of Tamil.

    Kannadanaadu, which spread from Kaveri to Godavari long, long ago, is slowly dimisnishing and disappearing, thanks to the migrant people like December Stud and his ilk. Kannada will also disappear and be replaced by Tamil, Malayalam etc. if Kannadigas do not shed their lethargy right now and fight for their rights with all their collective might.

    Why should movies made in Tamil, Telugu, Malayalam and Marathi be screened in Karnataka while Kannada movies are not screened outside Karnataka? Why should signboards be written all over Karnataka in these languages while there is no place for Kannada in the nameboards of our neighouring states? Even Hollywood movies dubbed into Tamil and Telugu are released in Karnataka in order to spread their languages among Kannadigas.

    Some years ago, one fine day the Tamils stormed the Door Darshan Kendra in Madras demanding broadcast of news in Tamil instead of Hindi and the Central Government obliged them immediately. Even the Hindi serials of many TV channels are dubbed into Tamil and broadcast in Tamil Nadu simultaneously. Why should Kannadigas oppose dubbed movies and serials? Kannada actors, directors, producers, journalists et al, kindly note that Kannada is more important than your pecuniary benefits. If Kannada survives you will flourish. If Kannada becomes extinct on account of the onslaught of other languages, you will perish. So, if you permit the proliferation of other languages in the form of movies etc. Kannada will die a natural death in a couple of decades. Boycott them. If Tamilians living in Bangalore are so adamant that they want to watch the latest Tamil movie, let them go to Hosur – which was a part of Karnataka not long ago- just a few kms away.

    In short, Kannadigas must bargain violently for their legitimate rights. As the ancient inscription says we must be like Kappe Arabhatta who was “saadhuge saadhu, maadhuryange maaduryan, baadhippa kalige kaliyuga vipareetan…”

  70. M G Shetty Says:

    The Tamil-is-the-mother-of-all-languages theory, propagated by die-hard Tamil chauvinists, is sheer bullshit. Dr. BGL Swamy, well-known botanist and Kannada litterateur, has exposed, in his book “TamiLu TalegaLa NaDuve”, the modus operandi of the Tamil scholars to keep this theory alive. They used to destroy all such books which doubt or question the antiquity of Tamil.

    Kannadanaadu, which spread from Kaveri to Godavari long, long ago, is slowly diminishing and disappearing, thanks to the migrant people like December Stud and his ilk. Kannada will also disappear and be replaced by Tamil, Malayalam etc. if Kannadigas do not shed their lethargy right now and fight for their rights with all their collective might.

    Why should movies made in Tamil, Telugu, Malayalam and Marathi be screened in Karnataka while Kannada movies are not screened outside Karnataka? Why should signboards be written all over Karnataka in these languages while there is no place for Kannada in the nameboards of our neighouring states? In Mangalore, Udupi, Manipal and some other towns and cities, only Malayalam nameboards are put up. The world famous KMC hospital in Manipal has Malayalam signboards all over. Why? Even Hollywood movies dubbed into Tamil and Telugu are released in Karnataka in order to spread their languages among Kannadigas.

    Some years ago, one fine day the Tamils stormed the Door Darshan Kendra in Madras demanding broadcast of news in Tamil instead of Hindi and the Central Government obliged them immediately. Even the Hindi serials of many TV channels are dubbed into Tamil and broadcast in Tamil Nadu simultaneously. Thus they want to propagate their language throughout their state. Why should Kannadigas oppose dubbed movies and serials? Kannada actors, directors, producers, journalists et al, kindly note that Kannada is more important than your pecuniary benefits. If Kannada survives, you will flourish. If Kannada becomes extinct on account of the onslaught of other languages, you will perish. So, if you permit the proliferation of other languages in the form of movies etc. Kannada will die a natural death in a couple of decades. Boycott them. If Tamilians living in Bangalore are so adamant that they want to watch the latest Tamil movie, let them go to Hosur – which was a part of Karnataka not long ago- just a few kms away.

    In short, Kannadigas must bargain violently for their legitimate rights. As the ancient inscription says we must be like Kappe Arabhatta who was “saadhuge saadhu, maadhuryange maaduryan, baadhippa kalige kaliyuga vipareetan…”

  71. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    DR. U. B. PAVANAJA email dated July 29th 2004

    Subject: font issues
    Date: 7/29/2004 12:18:00 PM Pacific Daylight Time
    From: pavanaja@vishvakannada.com
    Reply To:
    To: novaMed@aol.com , V. M. Kumaraswamy,
    CC:
    BCC:
    Sent on:
    Sent from the Internet (Details)

    namaskaara,

    I have attached the promised document on the font issues. Hope I can
    sleep peacefully now (it is 00:45 hrs in the night) :-)

    sigONa,
    Pavanaja
    _____________________________
    Dr. U.B. Pavanaja
    CEO, Vishva Kannada Softech
    Think Globally, Act locally
    ________________________________

    Font issues -Akruti, Baraha and Nudi

    by U B Pavanaja

    Birth of Baraha

    I had put up Kannada’s first web-site called Vishva Kannada during Dec. 1996 with the support of S K Anand of Cyberscape. Dynamic font technology was not being used by Vishva Kannada at that time. Akruti fonts were given for download at the web-site. Users have to download the font, install it in their PC and then they could read the Vishva Kannada web-site in Kannada. Sometimes in the first half of 1997, I got an email from Sheshadri Vasu who was at USA. In that mail he appreciated Vishva Kannada. He added that it takes a long time to copy characters through CharMap (an utility present in Windows to copy a glyph of a font into any application) and make a Kannada sentence. I explained him how to type in Kannada using the keyboard driver which has to be bought from Cyberscape. I gave the contact details of S K Anand and the approximate price of the software also. Then there was no mail from Vasu for some time. (Recently, during his visit to India in June 2004, Vasu wrote an article for Vijaya Karnataka, wherein he mentioned the discussions he had with me about the relation between font and keyboard driver). One day I got an email from Vasu saying that he has made a software called Baraha that can be used as an editor for Kannada. He wrote that he wanted to give this software free to everyone. The version sent to me was a beta version. He had actually written an editor for the font he downloaded from the web. I asked him about the copyright of the font. He had not thought anything about that. I explained to him the he need to take the permission of S K Anand of Cyberscape to use Akruti fonts in his software. He included the Kan Ballal font which was given to read Udayavani web-site with the first release of Baraha, which was given to some select friends only. Later on he changed the ASCII values of the glyphs of Akruti font and released the Baraha package officially. His idea was that just by changing the ASCII values of the glyphs, his font becomes different from Akruti font. But morally, ethically and legally, this amounts to violation of intellectual property rights. After a long gap of six years, recently (2004), Vasu admitted that he used the glyphs from Akruti fonts, in a mail to S K Anand.

    Fonts used in Nudi

    Now let me discuss the about the fonts bundled with Nudi. Nudi was initially thought as a testing software. This was made into a package later on. Myself and Harsha (the programmer who did the coding for Nudi) were opposing the release of Nudi without our own professional fonts. Making a font is an elaborate process. Artists have to draw each character (glyph) on paper, they have to be scanned, digitized, hinted, etc. It takes months for each font. C V Srinatha Sasthry (CVSS), Chief Secretary, Kannada Ganaka Parishat (KGP), told me that he got the font made from someone before submitting the final package to GoK. In one of the executive committee meeting S K Anand and myself questioned CVSS about who made the fonts, how much was paid to him, etc. G N Narsimha Murthy (GNNM), Secretary, KGP, gave a reply that someone at Koppa made the fonts. I mentioned that KGP should have the complete record of making of the fonts like original drawings by the artist, first raw digitized data, the final font, etc. GNNM promised to get all these from Koppa and show to us in the next meeting. He never bothered to do that.

    I came to know about the entire story about fonts much much later. Initially I used to believe the statements of CVSS about the fonts. But it took almost 2 years for me to accidentally discover the truth. While experimenting with opentype font creation, I was studying the glyphs of all Kannada fonts. When I opened Baraha, Akruti and Nudi fonts in a font editing software, I found that they all have the same glyph sets, even though their ASCII values are different. As Sathyanarayana has detailed in his write-up, the glyphs from Akruti fonts were used in the first version of Baraha, which was then used in the first version of Nudi. As per my knowledge CVSS got this conversion of font encodings done by someone here at Bangalore itself. The fonts were not made from scratch at Koppa. This is clear violation of intellectual property rights. I had a strong and heated argument with CVSS and GNNM about one or two months before the elections to the executive committee of KGP. I blasted CVSS for misleading me and telling lies to me that the fonts were developed at Koppa. CVSS and GNNM have told lies to me and cheated GoK by supplying them with pirated fonts. Definitely my position became very awkward that I being the mentor and the person in charge of Nudi in the initial stages was not informed of these backdoor activities by CVSS. I fired both CVSS and GNNM left and right. At that time GNNM even challenged me to prove these in the court along with S K Anand who had already threatened to sue KGP for violation of intellectual property rights.

    Vasu’s justification and the realities

    With this background let me discuss a bit of what Vasu has written in a document and widely circulated in mailing lists. This document is also present in his Baraha discussion group (groups.msn.com/baraha). Let me quote from this document-

    —————– Begin ———————————

    USA courts have long back decided that fonts can’t be copyrighted AT ALL! Here, the digital outline can never be protected. According to them there can’t be any original font style, because, every font is created by slightly modifying some other font, and there aren’t really “new” font designs! See the following excerpts from the law…

    “The Copyright Office has decided that digitized representations of typeface designs are not registerable under the Copyright Act because they do not constitute original works of authorship. The digitized representations of typefaces are neither original computer programs (as defined in 17 U.S.C. 101), nor original databases, nor any other original work of authorship.”

    So, in a font, the name, any programming code not describing the font design are all that can be copyrighted. This leaves the door open in the USA to have anyone pay for the output of each character from a typesetter and re-digitize it or extract the design from a font program (and rename it), easily duplicating the design. Most foundries have very similar fonts derived from work largely designed by others. More information about font/copyright can be found at http://ssifonts.com/Myths.htm

    ———————- End —————————-

    Vasu is very cleverly and conveniently quoting from a web-site put up in the year 1997 and has not been updated afterwards. There is a reason for this site not being updated afterwards. This refers to the classic legal battle between Adobe and SSI. Southern Software Inc. (SSI) used to copy and rename fonts from Adobe and others. They thought they were safe from prosecution because, though they had directly copied the points that define the shapes from Adobe’s fonts, they had moved all the points just slightly so they were not technically identical. Nevertheless, in his 1998 judgment, the judge determined that the computer code had been copied:

    The evidence presented shows that there is some creativity in designing the font software programs. While the glyph dictates to a certain extent what points the editor must choose, it does not dictate every point that must be chosen. Adobe has shown that font editors make creative choices as to what points to select based on the image in front of them on the computer screen. The code is determined directly from the selection of the points. Thus, any copying of the points is copying of literal _expression, that is, in essence, copying of the computer code itself.

    SSI lost the legal battle at the courts. Judgment was in favor of Adobe. Hence SSI did not update their web-site. Vasu is conveniently quoting from this web-site. One can read in detail about this case in the following web-sites:-

    http://scripts.sil.org/cms/scripts/page.ph…UNESCO_Font_Lic

    http://directory.serifmagazine.com/Ethics_…/judgement.php4

    http://www.ipcounselors.com/19980309.htm

    When we conducted a opentype font workshop at Bangalore during March 2003, there was a talk on IPR issues related to fonts by Lawrence Liang, who is an expert on cyber laws. He had discussed this Adobe vs SSI case.

    Vasu’s interview to Deccan Herald and my comments

    Vasu gave an interview to Deccan Herald during his visit to Bangalore in June 2004. Here are some excerpts and my comments on them:-

    > “Then, I, along with Ganaka Parishad and the State Government worked to bring Kannada software for official use”, he (Vasu) said.

    I don’t remember any of such efforts by Sheshadri Vasu. In fact Vasu was very reluctant to implement the GoK standard for font and keyboard. There was a heated argument between Dr Panditharadhya and K T Chandrashekharan, father of Vasu, in this connection. All along the time Shasthry, Narasimha Murthy and Panditharadhya were advocating that Baraha killed Kannada while Nudi saved it! Vasu did implement the keyboard and font standards after repeated appeals by Shrinatha Shasthry and Narasimha Murthy.

    > Baraha 4.0 was the first software that was implemented in Government offices with font styles.

    I don’t think this statement of Sheshadri Vasu is true. There were many Kannada software being used in state govt much much before KGP, Nudi or Baraha came into existence.

    > But the Ganaka Parishad and the State Government have introduced Nudi software as a benchmark system.

    If Vasu were to introduce the GoK standards much earlier than the release of Kalitha (Nudi), Nudi would not have come into existence.

    > Unfortunately for me, the government is insisting the use of Nudi software.

    Why should be unfortunate to him? He is not selling Baraha.

    > While Baraha has fulfilled the terms and conditions put forth by the Government, including stipulations such as keyboard and transliteration, I wonder why they are forcing departments to use only Nudi”, he said. One of Baraha’s many advantages, according to Vasu, is that it allows a person who knows Kannada to type it in English fonts. He felt preference of software (Baraha or Nudi) should be left to end user.

    Why the choice should be only between Nudi and Baraha, both of them are obsolete in the current and future time where Unicode is the world standard? Actually the choice should be between Windows XP/2003, Mac, Linux, Solaris, Java Desktop, Unix, etc. all are having Unicode compliance.

    Meeting with Vasu in June 2004

    Vasu was felicitated by Upasana in Bangalore during his visit in June 2004. I met him during that function. I discussed many things in general like Unicode features, facility needed in Baraha to convert RTF and HTML documents into Unicode, etc. Casually I asked him where from he is getting the fonts for his Baraha package. As per his answer, there is an artist in Bangalore who draws the shapes on paper and sends them to him. He (Vasu) scans, digitizes and makes them into fonts. I did not discuss anything about the Akruti font issue.

    Conclusion and request

    Baraha has copied and used one font from Akruti software. This font is one of the many fonts bundled with current version of Nudi.

    I have written everything that I know about the font issues pertaining to Akruti, Baraha and Nudi. My intention is to bring out the truth, however bitter it is. I have no personal animosity with anyone whose name appears in this write-up. Please read this objectively and subjectively. That is, do a vasthunistha (objective) reading rather than a vyakthinishta (subjective) reading.

    Thanks for your patience and time.
    _________________________________________

  72. December Stud Says:

    Gawd, isn’t this the same Kumaraswamy who is famous for the AKKA (America Kannada Kootagala Agara) politics ? (Not that any others in AKKA are saints !).

    Mr. Kumaraswamy, it’s a shame that you come and post some totally irrelevant post against Baraha in this forum. What are you planning to achieve really ?

    KP, this post needs to be removed…seriosuly. This is blatant slandering !!!

  73. rtiact2005 Says:

    Hello Stud,

    That was written by Dr. U. B. Pavanaja. Not by me.

    Why do you want STEAL something also and make money out of it ?

    What VASU did is STEALING GLYPHS from AKRUTHI FONTS and started offering it as FREE FONTS to Kannadigas. That’s all !!

    Read this email from VASU:

    This email from VASU of BARAHA shows the ADMISSION and ACKNOWLEDGEMENT and GUILT.

    ” I honestly admit that I have used the glyphs from one of the Akruti fonts in Baraha 1.0, and I was not very serious to mention about it.” Sheshadri Vasu.

    AKRUTI fonts developed by Mr. S. K. Anand.

    MR. S. K Anand is also making a CHARGE on KGP and it’s Executives for using his AKRUTI FONTS to develop KALITHA/NUDI Kannada Software and selling it GoK.
    _________________________________________________
    Mr. S. K. Anand’s email to V.M.Kumaraswamy and
    Mr. Sheshadri Vasu’s email to Mr. S. K. Anand

    —————–
    Forwarded Message:
    Subj: Fw: From Sheshadrivasu Chandrasekharan
    Date: 6/28/2004 11:01:59 AM Pacific Daylight Time
    From: anand@cyberscapeindia.com
    To: novamed@aol.com
    Sent from the Internet (Details)

    Shri Kumarswamy,

    Namaskaara,

    I think largely due to your relentless efforts to ferret out the truth behind the sad state of affairs in the area of Kannada software and the domination of false icons of the so called free software like KGP Nudi and Sheshadrivasu’s Baraha, a lot of bitter truth and hidden information is coming out from various quarters, which is exposing the nasty skullduggery by which these false icons have sucked on the blood of the real workers in the Kannada software arena who have never claimed that they and they alone have done a great service to Kannada, but have been contributing silently in the background.

    I am forwarding here, an admission by one such icon, the Guru of free Kannada software, who, perhaps due to the fear of getting exposed by these revelations, very belatedly realised the need for acknowledging the unabashed piracy. More than six years after his misdeed, he meekly apologises for having pirated our “Akruti” fonts. This is a charge we have also made on KGP. How many more years, do we have to wait for them to come clean?

    Anyway, I hope you keep churning the murky waters of the Kannada software world for more such nuggets. I sincerely hope at the end of this great “Samudra Manthan”, finally some true gems emerge and adorn our beloved “Kannada Maate” who must be hanging her head in eternal shame at the present state of affairs. All the behind the scene workers like us should be thankful for your fearless crusade against all the wrong doers.

    Hoping for a positive outcome for the sake of Kannada,

    Anand S.K.
    Managing Director
    Cyberscape Multimedia Ltd.
    ——————————————————————————-

    Mr. Sheshadri Vasu’s email to Mr. S. K. Anand

    —– Original Message —–
    From: Sheshadrivasu Chandrasekharan
    To:
    Sent: Tuesday, June 22, 2004 10:18 PM
    Subject: From Sheshadrivasu Chandrasekharan

    > Dear Mr. S.K. Anand,
    >
    > I recently saw a remark from you in one of the postings in an Internet
    > newsgroup which goes as follows…
    >
    > “We who have been developing such fonts (AKRUTI) well over two decades would
    > not like a repeat of the experience, we had when our fonts were pirated off
    > the Web and used without acknowledgement, first by an individual who went on
    > to release a free software…”
    >
    > I thought you may be referring to Baraha software in the above remark, and
    > hence is this email.
    >
    > When I started developing a Kannada software, I had no knowledge of fonts at
    > all. I experimented a lot with various Kannada fonts available in the
    > Internet, including Akruti. This research helped me to understand the
    > technology behind the Kannada fonts and I learnt a lot from these software.
    > Initially, I wanted Baraha compatible with other Kannada fonts. But due to
    > various limitations of such fonts, I had to come up with my own encoding.

    I honestly admit that I have used the glyphs from one of the Akruti fonts in Baraha 1.0, and I was not very serious to mention about it.
    When I released Baraha 1.0, I didn’t know it will become popular and used by many people. It was only an experiment which I wanted to share with my family and friends.

    > But later, when Baraha became popular, for copyright reasons, I had to add
    > my own fonts for Kannada and other languages. I have created many new font
    > styles, which don’t exist in any other Kannada software. My intention was to
    > provide the facility for basic documentation needs of Kannada. It was not my
    > intention to copy or re-create various Kannada font styles that are
    > available in other packages. Instead I have focussed more on portability of
    > Kannada text from Baraha to other software such as Akruti, ShreeLipi, e.t.c.
    >
    > Through this mail I would like to express my grattitude to various other
    > Kannada software for helping me to acquire the knowledge.

    My acknowldgements to Akruti software for providing the glyphs which were used in the intial releases of Baraha.

    I apologise for this delayed acknowledgement.

    >
    > Regards
    > Vasu
    > ***********************************************************
    > Free Kannada/Devanagari software – http://www.baraha.com
    > ***********************************************************

  74. Nostalgic Mysorean Says:

    Agree fully with DS-How come that post sneaked in here? No relevance of course.
    Reacting to Abhaya,she is perfectly right for the quality of her posts.True-my close relative who is somobody in Mysore literary circles has his children and grand children educated in English.Of course they have taken the Software Engineer_USA route.Coming to the beginning of this story,granting Classical language status to Kannada should be of paramount importance.
    Dr ramesh helidhange–sumnidre naav heege irbeku

  75. rk Says:

    Dear all,
    certainly not a very good morning.
    The great shehnai maestro USTAD BISMILLAH KHAN IS NO MORE. He breathed his last in the wee hours this morning. The Bharatha Rathna awardee was 91.
    I remember his soulful music in Dr. Rajkumar’s film “Sanaadi Appanna”. Yeshtu adbhutavaagi nudisidaare.
    It seems he used to play everyday at the Kashi Vishwanatha temple in Benares every morning since ages.
    Despite his fame, Khan’s lifestyle retained its old world charm and he continued to use the cycle rickshaw as his chief mode of transport till his death.
    Music world has lost a noble soul indeed. RIP, Bismillah ji.

  76. GIRISH HAMPALI Says:

    RK is breaking news as a comment. this definitely shows that churumuri is dead. RK I suggest you should post in the active blogs rather clinging on to the dead churumuri.

  77. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    Kannada, Kannadiga, Kannadigaru, Karnataka,

    Ella Kannadaabhimaanigala Anthararastriya Vedike Inda

    Kannadigarella hondagi Kannadavannu ulisona

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com

    Kannadigas need to wake up and do the right things in Karnataka State and press for Govt. of Karnataka to adopt KANNADA in all departments.

    Govt. of Karnataka is promoting STOLEN or PIRATED KANNADA FONTS. That should be stopped.

    KGP’s Monkey business

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/21/kgp%e2%80%99s-monkey-business-2/

    Shocking revelations about KGP found by Shri V. M. Kumaraswamy of E-KAVI

    https://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/19/shocking-revelations-about-kgp-found-by-shri-v-m-kumaraswamy-of-e-kavi/

    Anand, Akruti Fonts and Cyberscape Multimedia Ltd and Anand on KGP, NUDI and BARAHA

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/21/anand-akruti-fonts-and-cyberscape-multimedia-ltd-and-anand-on-kgp-nudi-and-baraha/

    SRG Systems Pvt. Ltd. (Software Research Group): SHABDARATNA and VENUS Publisher

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/21/srg-systems-pvt-ltd-software-research-group-shabdaratna-and-venus-publisher/

    All of these articles are not written by V. M. Kumaraswamy. It is a compilation of what has happened to Kannada Software Development in Karnataka State.

    VMK

  78. shankar karanth Says:

    Bangalore is the IT capital, BT highway, and so on and so forth the laurels go. However, what is the true share of Kannadigas in either making the city to be so, or at least in reaping the benefits brought about by these forces? It is truely insignificant. Like all other sectors in India, these too are bogged by the nepotism shown by the early beneficiaries. Now it has taken such a shape that even blackmailing is going on directing the state government to do such and such things in so and so manner. Otherwise the investors will run away!!!!. Arrey yaarige beku ee Investment. The governments have not been able to make the ordinary Kannadiga (those who are not in Bangalore) feel the benefits of development. The situation is very bad in places like north karnataka and dry lands like chitradurga. People are so ignorant of the happenings in this fast world, that they still think only government jobs make a man’s life secure. Who is going to educate them. Till this thing happens, it is irrelevent whether Kannada is a classical language or not.

  79. December Stud Says:

    Kumaraswamy,

    Are you an idiot ? Don’t try to play a cow here. What is the relevance of posting a more than an year old e-mail thread in this blog ? Did anyone ever talk about it here for you to just post this ? You seem to have a habit of posting this email anywhere and everywhere you see the word ‘kannada’. I have seen this at several places. And, thanks to people like you, I support Vasu more than I used to.

    Go get a life dude !!! You seem to have no better work than politicise everything. I bet you can’t comment a dime’s worth on any interesting debate here, Kannada or otherwise.

    Yeah, now I will lie down and relax !!! Let it come by….

  80. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    Hello December Stud,

    Why do’t you post in your real name and provide real email address.

    It looks like you are MORE THAN a FOOL and an IDIOT to write like this.

    Who cares for you !! NO ONE !!

    That is an informational email to people who understand things. It looks like you do not get it.

  81. rk Says:

    girish,
    just after posting the news here, i posted an interesting story involving dr.rajkumar and ustad bismillah khan, which has been carried in most of the newspapers today.
    you can read it here:

    http://bellurramki18.wordpress.com/2006/08/21/ustad-bismillah-khan-was-a-gentle-genius/

  82. Arun Padaki Says:

    Sometime back, during an exhibition at Manasa Gangothri, I saw a chart that said Kannada is a century senior to Tamil. The root of all South Indian languages of course was Tulu.

    *******

    Today, Bangalore is rotten because of the indiscriminate flouting of law, be it any large company or a small one. Any business that takes the local population and laws for granted should not be allowed to function. Enforcement has taken a back seat as there is loads money involved in allowing rule breaking. Being a corrupt State is icing on the cake for unfair businessmen/ businesses. With these businesses, come the work forces, skilled and others, resulting in unwanted culture-import (read as ‘culture’) from other regions. The change that we see on Brigade Road from the lovely mid-1990s is a testimony to this. Rule breakers range from a lager multinational like Accenture parking the buses next to the No-Parking sign on Bannerghatta Road cloggin the traffic, a Progeon building an impressive campus but still occupying the service lane to park hundreds of cars, a shop keeper encroaching the footpath on DVG Road, a Bishop Cotton’s school not letting the vans and autos inside, but choosing to wreck havoc on Residency Road, a builder from Delhi, Pune, Mumbai or Bangalore encroaching lakes and forest land, et al. All this is happening with the authorities involved.

    After Bangalore it will be Mysore very soon. And with the same kind of people in the administration, or even worse, things can be worse off at Mysore.

    The government has not made life easy for the people of the state. Unfortunately, the aim is to keep the industry happy by allowing abuse of the resources of the land. If any businessman says that there is no local talent, then why set up that particular business here? Even with merit as a norm, there is no dearth of talent in Karnataka, be it Engineering, banking, BT or IT. The preference simply has to be the locals and then the rest.

    Amongst many other ills to be fought, shouldn’t these law-breaking, corrupt practices be protested? Aren’t these practices laying the foundation for spoiling cities of Karnataka and in turn damaging the Kannada culture? If organizations like KRV get into protesting on these issues the way they do with others, the authorities too would think twice before signing on the dotted lines and more importantly the corrupt businessmen will be aware of what is in store for them.

    Else, we will be fighting and protesting to save Kannada, fighting to save another bastion of our culture.

  83. dr ramesh Says:

    spot on , sir
    you have summed it up very well.

    narayanmurthy, kiran mazumdar shaw …. etc should understand the growing unrest because of their anti-kannada stance and should mend their ways.

  84. Ramanuja Says:

    It is exasperating to note that the focus was shifting to some peripheral issues of linguistic origins etc.. of Kannada and Tamil. Nice to see at last that the main issue of due recognition of Kannada and Kannadigas is back again on the agenda. As I said before the times for wishes, hopes and expectations are over and nothing less than strong, peaceful mass agitation grown out of unrest would deliver the goods. Dharnas in front of every organisation that does not recognise the rightful place of Kannadigas are a good starting point.

  85. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    KANNADA AS A CLASSICAL LANGUAGE

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/23/kannada-as-a-classical-language/

  86. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    Hello December Stud,

    You know why KANNADA is lagging behind ?

    Because of people like you supporting STEALING and PIRATING.

    Sheshadri Vasu has written an email to this effect, even than you are writing that you are supporting Vasu. Actions like this by Kannadigas is not going to help. It is Disastrous for KANNADA language.

    What is wrong in bringing the TRUTH to the forefront ?

  87. V.R.Anil Kumar Says:

    What’s bugging Kumaraswamy? After all, even great scientists talk of standing on shoulders of those before them and reaching greater heights. Seshadri Vasu has not economically benefitted from this alleged piracy as Baraha is a free download. Is there a caste angle to this obvious hatred?

  88. ದೀರೇಂದ್ರ ಗೋಪಾಲ್ Says:

    Swamy Kumaranna …Steal or Loot as long as Kannada Udhaara everything OK.

    Yella ‘OK’ Baashe madhya Politics yaake .

    Another thingu Kumaranna ..naavu neevu nashvara..bhaashe ondhe shashwatha.neevu doddavru adhanna arithu bhaashe baLso karyakke kai
    adbittu kannada abhimaani na keNak bedi amele nanna baayee yathyathlo Oythadhe ..

  89. Prasad Says:

    DG namaskaara. Good to see you back here.

    Looks like there are several different threads of discussion going on under this post. Eradu-mooru Gali patada daara kattikonda haage!
    Dasara, Kannada baraha, Classical language & god knows what.

    It is high time we had new posts with all these different topics addressed separately.

  90. ದೀರೇಂದ್ರ ಗೋಪಾಲ್ Says:

    Yinnu Mundhuvarilee naavu kannadakkaagi yen maadbahudhu annodhu.
    1.Modhalu namma Makkalu,Maneyavaru,nere horeyavru jothe Kannada
    english padha kammi maadbeku.
    2.MakkaLa mele english yera bedi ..yaake andhre schoolnalli kalthkothare

    haage yinnu barali….

  91. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    Hello V R AnilKumar,

    I am not writing these things. Dr. U. B. Pavanaja has written a detailed letter regarding this issue of BARAHA.

    VASU himself has written that he has copied from AKRUTHI FONTS. VASU writes that he did not want to give it out KANNADIGAS. VASU did this for his family use. VASU could have stopped at that level. VASU went beyond that by offering FREE to KANNADIGAS.

    KANNADIGAS wants everything FREE, if it is available. AKRUTHI fonts was sold in open market.

    YES. Sheshadri Vasu has got benefitted by this. VASU has collected FUNDS in the name of BARAHA. VASU got recognised by most of the Kannada Kootas in USA because of BARAHA.

    BARAHA is PIRATED from AKRUTHI FONTS.

    BARAHA, NUDI, KAGAPA and KGP is spreading CASTE. KANNADA langauge does not have caste. KANNADA itself is a CASTE. KANNADA JATI.

  92. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    Hello DG,

    It is easy for you to write like this. By VASU offering BARAHA as FREE DOWNLOAD KANNADIGAS does not want to spend any money on KANNADA FONTS. This has put a stop on Kannada Software Development.

    I think VASU should put BARAHA FONTS in OPEN SOPURCE under GPL/GNU. So that all can use it and make changes to it. WHY VASU has not done this?

    So you will accept, if some one STEAL your CAR and sell that CAR to some one and use that MONEY for distributing to KANNADIGAS FREE. WOULD YOU AGREE ?

  93. Matyady Gopal Says:

    Matte bandide Ganesha Chauti… Eega arkestraagaLa kaala. Namma kannaDanaaDinalli naDeyuva saarvajanika samaarambhagaLalli tamiLu, telugu sinimaa haaDugLu bEke? nere raajyagaLalli yaavudaadaroo saarvajanika samaarambhadalli kannada haaDu haaDuvudannu endaadaroo kELiddeeraa?

    ArkestraadavarE, illi kELi.. kannaDigara svaabhimaanavannu keNakabEDi. ganEshOtsavakke kannaDa mattu hindi maatra saaku. neevu chennaige hOdaaga tamiLu, haidraabaadige hOdaaga telugu haaDi. kELiskonDraa?

    RakshaNaa vEdikeyavaroo itta gamana harisabEku…

  94. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    I have distanced myself from KAGAPA for many reasons

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/26/i-have-distanced-myself-from-kagapa-for-many-reasons/

    my further views in detail on the baraha and nudi developments

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/26/my-further-views-in-detail-on-the-baraha-and-nudi-developments/

    my assurance to complete writeup regarding KGP. [Kagapa and NUDI and BARAHA]

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/26/my-assurance-to-complete-writeup-regarding-kgp-kagapa-and-nudi-and-baraha/

    KSD Mysore Meeting Summary by Founding Secretary, of KGP A. Sathyanarayana

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/26/ksd-mysore-meeting-summary-by-founding-secretary-of-kgp-a-sathyanarayana-2/

    KAGAPA – kelavu apriya sathyagalu, KGP has sold STOLEN property to GoK.

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/26/kagapa-kelavu-apriya-sathyagalu-kgp-has-sold-stolen-property-to-gok/

  95. Prashanth Says:

    Swamy Kumara
    En saar nimdhu Kani, If Sheshadri is making Baraha Freeware whats yr problem….assume that he had copied from AKRUTHI, but did he not have had done a better job here….issue is not making it freeware…but it had helped increase the awareness of Kannda over Internet.

    Andu u yell that KANNADIGAS wants everything FREE, if available. This is the human tendency…not confined to kannadigas just…and its legal. But for the sake of it, it looks like u r generalizing for every Kannadiga….Swalpa break haaki swamy, Stand haakondu Cycle hodibedi….

    And what is Caste to do with Font, swamy neevi Raajakeeyadhalli irbekthu ( athva already idhira ), Nimma personal issues , egos ene idhru adhanna personal aaghe itkoli sir…..Public li beda

    Neevenaadhru Kannada Software development stop aagtha idhe for the want of funds antha ankondre heli swamy…if its for the betterment, funds caan always be raised…….Noodi enu prayojana illladhidru istondhu TAX katt thivi……Olledakke andhre Hinjariyolla sarina.

    Keep the cool head….

  96. Prashanth Says:

    For heavens Sake, dont Generalize things on Kannadigas……

    There is nothing called Kannada Jaathi….and dont try to invent one.
    Let us not figh like Dogs here, what we need is Unity among us in all respects.

    Think High…Think Big..Think Good

  97. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    Prashanth avare,

    Caste nanalla raise maadiddu. yaaru maadiddarinda naanu barediddu.

    KGP, KAGAPA and others have raised CASTE issue with MLC’s and MLA’s, when this issue came in GoK.

    snehithare dayavittu elru artha maadikolli kannada s/w avashyakathe bagge swalpa artha maadikolli

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/26/snehithare-dayavittu-elru-artha-maadikolli-kannada-sw-avashyakathe-bagge-swalpa-artha-maadikolli/

    Why VASU is not putting BARAHA in OPEN SOURCE ? FREEWARE is not going to help in KANNADA SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT and it has not helped.

    VASU’s BARAHA has helped only to NRI KANNADIGAS. Not is real KANNADA SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT in Karnataka State.

    PRASHANTH idannu odi:

    Font issues -Akruti, Baraha and Nudi : Dr. U.B. Pavanaja

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/21/font-issues-akruti-baraha-and-nudi-dr-ub-pavanaja/

  98. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    WAKE up KANNADIGAS:: Srinatha Sastry, Narasimha Murthy, Pandithradhya, KAGAPA, KGP, Pirated Nudi Fonts, Pirated BARAHA Fonts are RESPONSIBLE for DESTROYED and DESTROYING the KANNADA SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT in Karnataka State. Govt. of Karnataka need to WAKE UP on this ISSUE !!

    http://ellakavi.wordpress.com/2006/08/31/wake-up-kannadigas-srinatha-sastry-narasimha-murthy-pandithradhya-kagapa-kgp-pirated-nudi-fonts-pirated-baraha-fonts-are-responsible-for-destroyed-and-destroying-the-kannada-software-development-in-ka/

  99. V. M. Kumaraswamy Says:

    NUDI and BARAHA have destroyed the growth of KANNADA. In the name of FREE SOFT WARE BARAHA and FREE WARE NUDI, is jeopardizing the other SOFTWARE DEVELOPERS coming forward and developing more applications in KANNADA.

    We all know what has happened at KGP. What Srinatha Sastry, Pandithradhya and Narasimha Murhty has done at KGP and their PIRACY/COPYING of IPR of other person AKRUTI Fonts.

    We all have received the letters written by Mr. S. K. Anand, OWNER of AKRUTHI Fonts. AKRUTHI Fonts is the source for BARAHA and NUDI Fonts.

    We all have received the Email of VASU, ADMISSION OF GUILT by Sheshadri Vasu of BARAHA written to owner of AKRUTHI Fonts Mr. S. K. Anand.

    We all have received articles written by Dr. U. B. Pavanaja in detail the Birth of BARAHA and how BARAHA has been bundled in NUDI FONTS which is sold to Govt. of Karnataka for 30 Lakhs.

    We all know about APPLESOFT and what work they have done for KSD. One of the Kannada Software Developer affected by BARAHA and NUDI Fonts PIRACY.

    We all know about SRG Systems Ltd and it’s work for KSD since 1987. Is another Kannada Software Developer who stopped dealing with KANNADA since KGP / KAGAPA sold PIRATED NUDI Fonts to Govt. Of Karnataka. KAGAPA has put KSD in trouble with the help of BARAHA.

    VASU can tell now all over the world that he is providing FREE SOFTWARE. He is giving it FREE because it does not belong to him and someone else has put sweat equity and they were selling that one in open market. VASU and BARAHA has destroyed that opportunity for AKRUTI Fonts owner Mr. Anand. In the name of FREE KANNADA SOFTWARE BARAHA, VASU has destroyed the growth of KANNADA.

    We all have received articles written by KGP/KAGAPA Founding Secretary Mr. A. Sathyanarayana. He has explained in detail how NUDi came into existence by using BARAHA Fonts of VASU.

    We should question KGP and it’s THREE MAIN Executives, WHY THEY ARE KEEPING SILENT ON THESE ISSUES. They should be held responsible for all the wrong doings in KANNADA SOFTWARE.

    BARAHA and NUDI Kannada Fonts, Which are copied/Pirated have destroyed the growth of KANNADA Software. In the name of FREE SOFTWARE Kannadigas have been duped by BARAHA and NUDI.

    BARAHA has admitted his guilt. That itself shows whatever BARAHA is today is because of COPYING and PIRATING the INTELELCTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS “IPR” of some one elses product. That is how BARAHA started when it released BARAHA 1.0. BARAHA Fonts has created more problems to KSD.

    BARAHA needs to elaborate and show on it’s efforts on:

    1. Standardisation of KANNADA.

    2. Data Portability to various formats and OS of KANNADA.

    BARAHA’s VASU say: “I have focused more on standardization issues and portability of data to various formats and Operating Systems, which was ignored (deliberately for business interests?) by other software vendors.” It is easy for VASU to write this and make this statement to get people’s support. Now he needs to support what he has written here. He needs to write in detail what he has done to make this statement.

    NUDI and BARAHA have destroyed the growth of KANNADA. In the name of FREE SOFT WARE BARAHA and FREE WARE NUDI, is jeopardizing the other SOFTWARE DEVELOPERS coming forward and developing more applications in KANNADA. But still some are doing it. it is very hard for them until Govt. of Karnataka removes an order saying that all departments have to use NUDI Fonts.

    BARAHA has admitted his guilt. That itself shows whatever BARAHA is today is because of COPYING and PIRATING the INTELELCTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS “IPR” of some one else’s product. That is how BARAHA started when it released BARAHA 1.0.

    BARAHA needs to elaborate and show on it’s efforts on:

    1. Standardization of KANNADA.

    2. Data Portability to various formats and OS of KANNADA.

    BARAHA’s VASU say: “I have focused more on standardization issues and portability of data to various formats and Operating Systems, which was ignored (deliberately for business interests?) by other software vendors.” It is easy for VASU to write this and make this statement to get people’s support. Now he needs to support what he has written here. He needs to write in detail what he has done to make this statement.

    NUDI and BARAHA have destroyed the growth of KANNADA. In the name of FREE SOFT WARE BARAHA and FREE WARE NUDI, is jeopardizing the other SOFTWARE DEVELOPERS coming forward and developing more applications in KANNADA. But still some are doing it. it is very hard for them until Govt. of Karnataka removes an order saying that all departments have to use NUDI Fonts.

    V. M.Kumaraswamy

  100. ramesh Says:

    hello kannadigas
    plz do not include telugus along with tamils,becoz telugu people are not the migarants to karnataka,their native place is karnataka(bellary,hubli,kolar,bangalore,tumkur) etc has large population of telugus.they are not migarants,they are the natives of karnataka.
    telugu people always went hand in hand with kannadigas

    if tamil is an acient langauge why there are many words of sankrit in tamil
    1.seegram
    2.madham
    3.varudam
    4.kaaryam etc etc
    all are sanskrit words in tamil there are hundreds of sanskrit words in tamil
    so,how can u conclude tamil as classical language

    if u c greatness of telugu
    telugu is 2nd largest spoken language in india
    telugu is called “ITALIAN OF THE EAST” as their are only two languages in the world where all words end with vowel sounds
    to the tamil people,telugus constitue 20 % of tamil nadu population.40% of chennais population are telugu.in districts of vellore,krishnagiri,dharmapuri,salem etc ,50% population is telugu
    an a.p 9 % speak urdu ,so ap govt recognized urdu as official language of state.
    but in tamil nadu 37%of people are telugus(telugus in t.n are slowly forgetting their lang.due to fanatism of tamils).did t.n govt made telugu as official langauge?then how t.n people ask for tamil as official language of bangalore?where only 25 % are tamils
    today telugu films release in a.p,t.n,karnataka,maharastra,orissa,chattisgarh are in cities of hyderabad,chennai,bangalore,mumbai,pune,delhi(only few shows) AND TELUGU MOVIE MAKERS ALSO CREATED MARKET IN THE OVERSEAS LIKE USA,UK,CANADA,GERMANY,UAE,DUBAI,KUWAIT,MUSCAT,SINGAPORE,MALAYLSIA,NEWZEALAND,AUSTRALIA,IRELAND SO THERE IS NO THREAT FOR TELUGU LANGUAGE
    KANNADIAGS AND TELUGUS WAKE UP AND SAVE THEIR LANGUAGE FROM OTHER SOUTH INDIANS

  101. ramesh Says:

    one thing to kannadigas
    non kannadiags didnt migarate to karnataka even before partition of states their were lots of telugu people in karnataka.like bellary has 60 % of telugu,but it was not given to andhrites becoz of follishness of telugus

    telugu constitue 20% of karnataka and 25 % of bangalore alone
    telugu cinema is 2nd largest cinema industry and aswell tamil is next to telugu cinema if tamil films dont get dubbed to telugu. since tamil films are dubbed to telugu tamil cinema is 2nd largest other wise telugu cinema occupies 2nd position
    telugu population is in all south cities
    hyderabd(70% telugus)
    chennai(40 % telugu)
    bangalore(25%)telugu)
    but telugus didnt fight for rights in these states as they respect other languages and other people

    telugu is largest spoken laguage is south,since telugu people are good,soft and kind most of non telugus show interest in learning telugu
    if u create fanatism to non kannadigas as in karnataka no onw will learn kannada
    once when i came to bangalore a north indian came to me and asked it is karnataka no?
    but when all sign boards in bangalore are written in telugu(he felt kannada script as telugu)
    but me beingv telugu i said it is not telugu and is kannada similar to telugu
    ALL KANNADIGAS AND TELUGUS FIGHT AGAINST OTHER LANGUAGES IN SOUTH WHICH WANT TO DOMINATE US

  102. N.S. Manjunath Says:

    Although late by a few months, I would like to respond to PDCS observations.

    PDCS writes: Yesterday, Mysore’s Kannada intellectuals and activists were in the streets again, demanding the status of classical language to Kannada. Here is a comprehensive report in the Hindu on yesterday’s events. Their chosen target this time was the Central Institute of Indian Languages (CIIL), which as its director Dr. Uday Narayan Singh rightly pointed out does not have the statutory authority to accord the status.

    Anyway, today’s controversy isn’t about where Prof. Jaware Gowda and his friends chose to protest. Dr. Singh, who was out of town, responded to the demands of the agitators in English, which has made Prof. Gowda mad. He wants Dr. Singh to be removed from his position for not knowing/learning Kannada.

    Is it incumbent upon the Director of CIIL, a Central government entity or its employees to learn Kannada?”

    …..then PDCS talks about many unfinished tasks waiting upon Kannadigas and so on. I take his concerns in good faith and I agree with him. But I completely agree with Prof. Jaware Gowde because as the head of CIIL Dr. Singh should damn well know some Kannada. I mean, Dr. Singh is the head of CIIL, isn’t he? So he better have some knowledge of Kannada by way of speech and writing. I think it is for Dr. Singh to realize that he is not some pen pusher in any government office but a serious official in charge of languages and their impact on Indian life. QED.

  103. Narendra Says:

    Namaskara.

    I use Solaris 10 for all my workings and many of my Kannada friends also do the same. Right now, I am not able to see the pages of kannadaprabha or prajavani or thatskannada properly oin my browser.
    To my understanding, that’s due to the facts that kannada fonts haven’t been ported to Solaris properly.
    Is there any effort going on in this direction?
    If not, I can take it up, if somebody who has knowledge in the font creation (and similar) field can guide me.

    Please do respond to this mail at the earliest.

    Dhanyavaadagalu.

    Ithi,
    Narendra

  104. vinay Says:

    did u try Solaris 10 3/05 release ??? it has kannada

  105. Narendra Says:

    I am using Solaris Nevada_62.
    I have installed few Kannada fonts such as Kedage, Mallige and Nudi.
    But, when I view webpages having kannada fonts, I am not able to read it properly. I see lot of garbage.
    So, do I have to enable anything?

    Regards,
    Narendra

  106. vinay Says:

    I am sorry , I have no idea abt Nevada_62

  107. vinay Says:

    why dont u go to http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/int_localization/discussions/ and post ur requirement at http://www.opensolaris.org/jive/forum.jspa?forumID=161

  108. ramesh Says:

    tamil,telugu and kannda are equally ancient .

    all these are derived from the proto dravidian language(moola dravida baashe or the aadhi dravida baashe)

    telugu and kannada when they divided from proto dravidian language they made many changes to proto dravidian languages and emerged as distince.
    but tamil was a full and full copy of proto drabidian language and retained most of proto drabvidian language,

    that is reason why tamil is considered ancient,which is actually a wrong fact.
    the script of tamil is also a copy of proto dravidian. tamil did not develop any distict script and they took just the proto dravidian script.

    but kannada and telugu develeloped a script of their own which is totally different from proto dravidian .

    many people also say tamil has very less sanskrit words than kannda and telugu ,so they claim tamil to be ancient. this is a wrong fact.

    tamil even had huge sanskrit words.but during the medeival days purification of tamil took place so as to remove sanskrit words.

    but this work of purification was a big flop.as even now there are many sankrit words in tamil.

    this kind purification work was not done by telugu or kannda.
    thats it.
    all are eually ancient.

    all the 3 have the status to become classical languages.
    this is not fair for UPA govt. to accord classical status only to tamil.

    is this a democratic country????.

    getting some thing by threatening will dont deserve.
    DMK threatened CONGRESS for ancient status to tamil.
    later the ame tamil nadu leaders warned central govt. not to give ancient status to any other language.
    is it not a kind of cheap politics and some kind fanatism.
    its time namma kannadiagas mathu telugus to join and fight for their cause.
    banni kannadigas telugu jothe kaigalu sersi namma bashe goskara fight madona.

    kannadigas and telugus jointly need to fight for their languages. iam a proud kannadiga

    i shall leave you a site which shows all south languages are derived from proto dravidian language,

    tamil,telugu and kannada are eually ancient.
    this map in the site shows tamil needed many steps and process to become distinct.
    if u see at telugu and kannada they have not made many steps in their formation .

  109. shreyas Says:

    This is a very old argument and is a very tough one. Here, there are points on both sides, we need to take things delicately. But I think it is absolutely logical for anyone to realize that Kannada should be given priority at least in Karnataka. And kannadiga’s should be given the advantage of some reservation like thing so that more kannada people are employed in companies running in Bangalore. It can’t be overlooked!

    Here is my addition to the IT world of Kannada, this website called http://quillpad.in/kannada/ which transliterates from english to kannada and helps Kannada writing easier. I think it is a question of ethnicity here and it should be seriously taken and answered by the powers that be!
    Thanks.

  110. baba Says:

    Dear all,
    NANU KANNADIGA. BAHALA NOVAGUTHE.
    KANNDADLLI YESTU BASHI. SHREE LIPI, NUDI, C-DAK, WINKEY,
    BARAHA,
    YEENU YESTEDAYO DEVAREGI GOTUU.
    BABA

  111. raghavendra Says:

    hai

    nimma kannadabhimanakke shubhavagali

  112. Mohan Says:

    Hi Abhaya,

    I also studied in Manasagangothri school till 10th STD and I was in Kannada medium. I completly agree with you. It is going to be very difficult for us to compete with others when we study in Kannada medium school. I was one of them.

    Mohan
    Melbourne, Australia

  113. Mani USA Says:

    Let Truth be known !

    http://tamil.berkeley.edu/Tamil20Chair/TamilClassicalLanguage/TamilClassicalLgeLtr.html

    Hello all,

    I thought when the world renowned Berkely University California had done research and given assessment on classical languages of teh world, then we indians should atleast know the truth from facts reserach and and wither ignorance.

    April 11, 2000
    Statement on the Status of Tamil as a Classical Language

    Professor Maraimalai has asked me to write regarding the position of Tamil as a classical language, and I am delighted to respond to his request.

    I have been a Professor of Tamil at the University of California, Berkeley, since 1975 and am currently holder of the Tamil Chair at that institution. My degree, which I received in 1970, is in Sanskrit, from Harvard, and my first employment was as a Sanskrit professor at the University of Wisconsin, Madison, in 1969. Besides Tamil and Sanskrit, I know the classical languages of Latin and Greek and have read extensively in their literatures in the original. I am also well-acquainted with comparative linguistics and the literatures of modern Europe (I know Russian, German, and French and have read extensively in those languages) as well as the literatures of modern India, which, with the exception of Tamil and some Malayalam, I have read in translation. I have spent much time discussing Telugu literature and its tradition with V. Narayanarao, one of the greatest living Telugu scholars, and so I know that tradition especially well. As a long-standing member of a South Asian Studies department, I have also been exposed to the richness of both Hindi literature, and I have read in detail about Mahadevi Varma, Tulsi, and Kabir.

    I have spent many years — most of my life (since 1963) — studying Sanskrit. I have read in the original all of Kalidasa, Magha, and parts of Bharavi and Sri Harsa. I have also read in the original the fifth book of the Rig Veda as well as many other sections, many of the Upanisads, most of the Mahabharata, the Kathasaritsagara, Adi Sankara’s works, and many other works in Sanskrit.

    I say this not because I wish to show my erudition, but rather to establish my fitness for judging whether a literature is classical. Let me state unequivocally that, by any criteria one may choose, Tamil is one of the great classical literatures and traditions of the world.

    The reasons for this are many; let me consider them one by one.

    First, Tamil is of considerable antiquity. It predates the literatures of other modern Indian languages by more than a thousand years. Its oldest work, the Tolkappiyam,, contains parts that, judging from the earliest Tamil inscriptions, date back to about 200 BCE. The greatest works of ancient Tamil, the Sangam anthologies and the Pattuppattu, date to the first two centuries of the current era. They are the first great secular body of poetry written in India, predating Kalidasa’s works by two hundred years.

    Second, Tamil constitutes the only literary tradition indigenous to India that is not derived from Sanskrit. Indeed, its literature arose before the influence of Sanskrit in the South became strong and so is qualitatively different from anything we have in Sanskrit or other Indian languages. It has its own poetic theory, its own grammatical tradition, its own esthetics, and, above all, a large body of literature that is quite unique. It shows a sort of Indian sensibility that is quite different from anything in Sanskrit or other Indian languages, and it contains its own extremely rich and vast intellectual tradition.

    Third, the quality of classical Tamil literature is such that it is fit to stand beside the great literatures of Sanskrit, Greek, Latin, Chinese, Persian and Arabic. The subtlety and profundity of its works, their varied scope (Tamil is the only premodern Indian literature to treat the subaltern extensively), and their universality qualify Tamil to stand as one of the great classical traditions and literatures of the world. Everyone knows the Tirukkural, one of the world’s greatest works on ethics; but this is merely one of a myriad of major and extremely varied works that comprise the Tamil classical tradition. There is not a facet of human existence that is not explored and illuminated by this great literature.

    Finally, Tamil is one of the primary independent sources of modern Indian culture and tradition. I have written extensively on the influence of a Southern tradition on the Sanskrit poetic tradition. But equally important, the great sacred works of Tamil Hinduism, beginning with the Sangam Anthologies, have undergirded the development of modern Hinduism. Their ideas were taken into the Bhagavata Purana and other texts (in Telugu and Kannada as well as Sanskrit), whence they spread all over India. Tamil has its own works that are considered to be as sacred as the Vedas and that are recited alongside Vedic mantras in the great Vaisnava temples of South India (such as Tirupati). And just as Sanskrit is the source of the modern Indo-Aryan languages, classical Tamil is the source language of modern Tamil and Malayalam. As Sanskrit is the most conservative and least changed of the Indo-Aryan languages, Tamil is the most conservative of the Dravidian languages, the touchstone that linguists must consult to understand the nature and development of Dravidian.

    In trying to discern why Tamil has not been recognized as a classical language, I can see only a political reason: there is a fear that if Tamil is selected as a classical language, other Indian languages may claim similar status. This is an unnecessary worry. I am well aware of the richness of the modern Indian languages — I know that they are among the most fecund and productive languages on earth, each having begotten a modern (and often medieval) literature that can stand with any of the major literatures of the world. Yet none of them is a classical language. Like English and the other modern languages of Europe (with the exception of Greek), they rose on preexisting traditions rather late and developed in the second millennium. The fact that Greek is universally recognized as a classical language in Europe does not lead the French or the English to claim classical status for their languages.

    To qualify as a classical tradition, a language must fit several criteria: it should be ancient, it should be an independent tradition that arose mostly on its own not as an offshoot of another tradition, and it must have a large and extremely rich body of ancient literature. Unlike the other modern languages of India, Tamil meets each of these requirements. It is extremely old (as old as Latin and older than Arabic); it arose as an entirely independent tradition, with almost no influence from Sanskrit or other languages; and its ancient literature is indescribably vast and rich.

    It seems strange to me that I should have to write an essay such as this claiming that Tamil is a classical literature — it is akin to claiming that India is a great country or Hinduism is one of the world’s great religions. The status of Tamil as one of the great classical languages of the world is something that is patently obvious to anyone who knows the subject. To deny that Tamil is a classical language is to deny a vital and central part of the greatness and richness of Indian culture.

    (Signed:)
    George L. Hart
    Professor of Tamil
    Chair in Tamil Studies

  114. Lingappa Says:

    Shivanna abstained from voting . He will give up the cause for Kannadigas also if offered money

  115. Tashi Says:

    Hi guys! Nice to go through the discussions by scholars and experts. I just would like to clarify one point here. Somebody has mentioned that Hindi is our National language which is absolutely wrong. Hindi does not have any special status compare with other major languages (including Kannada) EXCEPT it is an official language of the govt. and English is an Associate official language. All the languages included in the 8th scheduled of the constitution (i.e. 22 languages) are National Languages. Therefore, Hindi got a special status compare to other major languages that is “an official language”….NOT a national language…….I am not against Hindi, but thats the fact…….many people have this misunderstanding…….

  116. prashanthi.N.Rao Says:

    namma nadu kannada nadu.I like kannada. I find more confidence at karnataka.I studied kannada.My favourite places are chikkapete(avenue road),K.R.Pura santey and govt.college.My favourite place is talakadu where kaveri nadhi flows.nanna janma sarthaka vayithu kaveriyalli snana madi.

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